[a.
 Presentation on “Transit Fresh Look” Study – Wasatch Front Regional Council]
          [00:03:01]
          BUS. RAPID TRANSIT ENHANCED BUS COULD BE A LIGHT RAIL. 
          I THINK I SAID BUS RAPID TRANSIT, AND WE'RE SORT OF EXPLORING IDEAS THAT MAY NOT HAVE BEEN
LOOKED AT BEFORE AND FOR A BUNCH OF REASONS, BUT ONE OF THEM IS THAT THERE'S JUST, YOU KNOW,
IT'S A RAPIDLY GROWING PART OF THE REGION. 
          SOMETIMES THE GROWTH UNFOLDS DIFFERENTLY THAN WE THOUGHT IT WOULD. 
          AND THERE'S NEW OPPORTUNITIES, INCLUDING A NEW FRONTRUNNER STATION. 
          JUST WEST OF THE POINT DEVELOPMENT. SO THERE'S A PARTNERSHIP OF COMMUNITIES THAT I
MENTIONED. 
          YOU CAN SEE THOSE LISTED OTHER STAKEHOLDERS AND TRANSPORTATION PARTNERS WORKING TOGETHER
TO SAY, WHAT IS OUR VISION? AND LET'S EXPLORE WHAT IT MIGHT TAKE TO GET THAT VISION TO BE
COMPLETED. 
          MAYOR BURTON AND PAUL JEROME FROM WEST JORDAN HAVE BEEN SERVING IN THAT CAPACITY ON THE
PARTNERSHIP COMMITTEE. 
          WE ARE FAIRLY LATE IN THIS EFFORT, BUT NOT TOO LATE. 
          SO WE'VE EXPLORED IDEAS, WE'VE REFINED THOSE IDEAS. 
          WE'RE STARTING TO GET TO THE POINT WHERE WE'RE THE PARTNERSHIP IS GOING TO ESTABLISH A
DESIRED VISION. 
          THAT VISION IS MALLEABLE. IT CAN CHANGE OVER TIME. 
          BUT THE IDEA IS, WHAT SHOULD WE START TO WORK ON TOGETHER? AND THEN LET'S CONTINUE TO TAKE FEEDBACK, INPUT FROM ALL OF THE PARTIES,
INCLUDING ALL OF THE COMMUNITIES, AND REFINE THAT VISION OVER TIME. BUT IT'S A IT'S IT'S A STATEMENT OF WHAT WE WANT TO WORK
TO ACCOMPLISH. 
          WE ARE SO WHAT'S HAPPENING IS THERE IS A MEETING JUST ON MONDAY OF JUST THE SALT LAKE
COUNTY MEMBERS OF THE PARTNERSHIP TO TAKE A LOOK AT THE VISION, THE DRAFT VISION. AND TO SAY, DOES THIS LOOK ABOUT RIGHT? AND I'M GOING TO SHOW YOU WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO LOOK AT. 
          [00:05:01]
THEY'RE GOING TO THESE ARE THE SAME EXCEPT FOR TWO LINES. 
          THERE'S A SCENARIO ONE AND A SCENARIO TWO. AND THIS REPRESENTS,
AGAIN EXPLORATION IDEAS, REFINEMENT FROM THE PARTNERSHIP FOR PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION. THESE LINES, YOU CAN SEE WEST JORDAN ON THE NORTH END OF THE STUDY
AREA. 
          YOU'D IN THIS SCENARIO WOULD HAVE THE MOUNTAIN VIEW CORRIDOR BUS RAPID TRANSIT LINE
HEADING SOUTHBOUND OUT OF WEST JORDAN. AS PART OF THE EFFORT. 
          AND HERE, ONE OF THE KEY THINGS TO NOTE IS THIS BRIGHT RED LINE IS HEADING SOUTH FROM THE
CURRENT END OF THE RED LINE AND THEN ACROSS OFF BANGERTER HIGHWAY. THAT WOULD BE BUS RAPID TRANSIT IN THIS SCENARIO. 
          AND THEN YOU CAN SEE THIS DARKER RED LINE HEADING SOUTHBOUND ALONG PORTER ROCK DOWN NEAR. 
          I'M POINTING WITH MY FINGERS IF YOU CAN TELL WHERE I HAVE A LASER POINTER. 
          YEAH. THE LASER POINTER DOESN'T WORK ON THE TV SCREEN. 
          OH, SHOOT. JUST KIDDING. I YEAH, SO FEEL FREE TO STAND UP. 
          YEAH, I'LL DO THAT. I'LL DO THAT. CAN YOU DO THAT ALONG THE CORRIDOR AND THEN CONNECTING
ALONG PORTER ROCKWELL BOULEVARD AND THAT BEING AN EXTENSION OF THE RED LINE ACTUALLY AS A LIGHT RAIL LINE. 
          THIS IS SOMETHING THAT THE PARTNERSHIP HAS BEEN LOOKING AT. 
          THERE'S BEEN SOME FEEDBACK AND DISCUSSION ABOUT. 
          MAYBE ANOTHER OPTION HERE IS THAT BANGERTER HIGHWAY BECOMES THE EXTENSION OF THE RED
LIGHT, RED LINE LIGHT RAIL, AND THAT FURTHER DOWN AND THEN HEADING DOWN SOUTH INTO UTAH COUNTY
WOULD INSTEAD BE A BUS RAPID TRANSIT. 
          SO THESE ARE A COUPLE OF OPTIONS THAT THE PARTNERSHIP COMMITTEE ARE GOING TO PARTNERSHIP
WILL LOOK AT ON MONDAY. 
          AND YOU CAN SEE THAT IT'S NOT PERHAPS DIRECTLY IMPACTFUL ON WEST JORDAN,
BUT IT IS IMPACTFUL ON THE OVERALL TRANSIT SYSTEM IN THE SOUTHWEST VALLEY AND WHAT PROBABLY, IN EFFECT,
HOW MANY, YOU KNOW, THE UTILITY OF TRANSIT FOR RESIDENTS IN WEST JORDAN, THEY COULD GET TO MORE DESTINATIONS AS A FUNCTION OF THESE KINDS
OF IDEAS. 
          ONE OF THE IDEAS THAT I THINK IS OF PARTICULAR NOTE TO WEST JORDAN IS THE IDEA OF A OF BUS
RAPID TRANSIT, OR AT LEAST ENHANCED BUS ALONG REDWOOD ROAD,
AND A SIGNIFICANT IMPROVEMENT ALONG THAT CORRIDOR. 
          WANTED TO SHARE THAT IDEA WITH YOU AND THEN AGAIN,
THIS THIS CONCEPT OF THIS WOULD BE IN ONE OF THE TWO SCENARIOS THAT WE'LL LOOK AT ON MONDAY OF BUS RAPID TRANSIT CONNECTING FROM WHAT IS THE NAME OF THIS STATION,
5600 WEST. 
          YEAH. THANK YOU. THANKS. EXTENDING SOUTHBOUND ALONG MOUNTAIN VIEW CORRIDOR AND WOULD
REALLY BE A KEY TWO COUNTY CONNECTION ON BUS RAPID TRANSIT. YOUR THOUGHTS AND IDEAS ARE VERY WELCOME ON THIS. 
          AND YOU'VE GOT A COUPLE OF REPRESENTATIVES, BUT IF YOU WANTED TO COME TO THIS PARTNERSHIP
COMMITTEE, YOU COULD DO THAT. BUT I WANTED TO GIVE YOU A SENSE OF WHERE IT'S AT. 
          MAYOR. DO YOU WANT TO ADD ANYTHING ON THIS? AS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IT,
I THINK I THINK THIS HAS BEEN GOOD. 
          THE PROBLEM WITH PAUL BEING THERE IS PAUL'S TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO GET BACK TO EAGLE
MOUNTAIN FROM HERE. DON'T WAIT. 
          IT'S TIME TO GET BACK. YEAH, IT'S JUST A PERSONAL INTEREST. 
          THEY'RE HOLDING ONTO ME. BUT I REALLY LIKE THE REDWOOD ROAD IDEA. 
          BECAUSE REDWOOD ROAD COVERS THREE COUNTIES. YEAH. 
          IF YOU GO FAR, FAR ENOUGH NORTH, YOU'RE DAVIS COUNTY. 
          THEN YOU GO SALT LAKE COUNTY. THEN YOU GO INTO UTAH COUNTY AND THE THE INFRASTRUCTURE IS
ALREADY THERE. 
          THAT IDEA IS ONE OF THE IDEAS THAT I THINK IS THE MOST SUPPORTED ACROSS THE ENTIRE
PARTNERSHIP. 
          THAT'S NOT HOW YOU GET A RAPID TRANSIT ON REDWOOD,
BECAUSE, I MEAN, YOU CAN GET TRANSIT ON REDWOOD, BUT I'M NOT SURE ABOUT REDWOOD IS RAPID. RAPID MEANS IT HAS LESS STOPS. 
          SO IT'S GOT TRAFFIC. YOU MEAN LESS? YEAH. WELL,
YEAH, IT'S STILL STOPS. 
          PICKUPS. IT'S NOT LIKE IT'S A DEDICATED LINE OR ANYTHING. 
          YEAH. DESIGNATED. I WOULD JUST ADD THAT THERE'S AN OPPORTUNITY IF IF WE WERE TO LOOK AT
SOMETHING LIKE THAT, THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS THAT YOU COULD DO. AND ON THE THE FAR END WOULD BE SOME SORT OF
EITHER DEDICATED LANE OR SHOULDER RUNNING. 
          SO IT HAS ITS OWN KIND OF LIKE IN PROVO WHERE THEY HAVE THE OREM TO BYU,
WHICH WHICH CERTAINLY MAKES IT A LOT MORE APPEALING IF YOU'RE SITTING IN TRAFFIC AND SEEING THE BUS GO BY, YOU MIGHT THINK, HEY, MAYBE THE BUS IS A GOOD OPTION. 
          [00:10:03]
BUT OTHER THINGS IN TERMS OF LIKE A QUEUE JUMP AT AN INTERSECTION WHERE IT CAN GET TO THE
FRONT OF THE LINE AND USE TRANSIT SIGNAL PRIORITY TO EXTEND A GREEN LIGHT. THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS IN STOP OPTIMIZATION,
YOU KNOW, AND SPACING. 
          THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS THAT CAN BE THERE'S A WHOLE RANGE OF THINGS THAT CAN BE DONE TO
LANE FILTERING FOR BUSSES, LIKE MOTORCYCLES. YEAH, JUST PUT A WEDGE ON THE FRONT OF THE BUS AND I,
ME AND MY BAD MANNERS. 
          I FAILED TO INTRODUCE ALEX BAME AND CHANDLER YOU KNOW SORRY. 
          IT'S THIS IS JUST HAPPENS WHEN I'M NERVOUS CHANDLER BUELLER FROM THE UTAH TRANSIT
AUTHORITY HERE TO SUPPORT THIS. 
          THEY'RE WELCOME TO JOIN YOU AT THE TABLE IF YOU'D LIKE THEM TO. MR. KNOWLTON? SURE. MY CONCERN WITH REDWOOD WOULD BE WHAT YOU'VE ALREADY HEARD. 
          REDWOOD IS ALREADY A VERY BUSY ROAD WITH LOTS OF STOP AND GO. 
          AND UNLESS YOU'RE WANTING TO SPEND BILLIONS OF DOLLARS TO ACQUIRE PROPERTY,
THERE'S NOWHERE TO GO. 
          IF YOU PUT A BUS ON THERE, YOU'RE JUST ADDING MORE TRAFFIC. 
          AND I'M NOT SURE THIS IS WHAT I HEAR ALL THE TIME. 
          WHY WE DON'T USE RAPID TRANSIT. BECAUSE WE CAN GET FASTER. 
          NOT ON RAPID TRANSIT, NOT ON TRACKS, NOT ON A BUS. 
          WE CAN GET THERE FASTER IN OUR CARS. SO THE MOTIVATION ISN'T THERE. 
          SO WHATEVER WE DO, IF WE'RE GOING TO, AS A SOCIETY,
INVEST, WE NEED TO INVEST SMART. 
          YEAH. IN A WAY THAT DRAWS PEOPLE, NOT MAKES PEOPLE ANGRY. 
          AND FOR WEST JORDAN, WHAT I'M SEEING, NOTHING'S REALLY GOING TO HELP US THAT MUCH. 
          IT'S GOING TO BRING PEOPLE THROUGH OUR CITY AND ALLOW US TO GET TO UTAH COUNTY,
WHICH FOR MR. JEROME IS EXCELLENT, BUT FOR ME, I WANT TO DRAW PEOPLE INTO WEST JORDAN. 
          THIS JUST GETS THEM A WAY TO BYPASS STOPPING IN WEST JORDAN AND ADDS TO TRAFFIC ON
REDWOOD. 
          SO THOSE ARE MY COMMENTS FOR YOU. ROUTE 66. I THINK IF A IF A BUS IS WELL UTILIZED,
IT WOULD BE A TRAFFIC IMPROVEMENT, BUT NOT A SIGNIFICANT ONE, WHICH I THINK IS PART OF YOUR. 
          YEAH, IF THEY'RE IF THEY'RE IN THE SAME TRAFFIC THE,
THE REST OF MY RESIDENTS ARE IN, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO UTILIZE. 
          IF THERE WAS A DEDICATED LINE MOVE THE CARS UP AND DOWN REDWOOD. 
          MAYBE. BUT THE THING WITH REDWOOD IS IT'S DUPLICATIVE OF FRONTRUNNER. 
          YOU'RE NOT THAT FAR AWAY FROM FRONTRUNNER AT ANY POINT ON REDWOOD. 
          YOU'RE TRUE. YOU'RE YOU KNOW, AND THERE'S ALREADY BUSSES THAT GO BETWEEN THE FRONTRUNNER
STOPS AND REDWOOD. 
          IT WOULD DEFINITELY SERVE SHORTER TRIPS THAN FRONT. 
          YEAH. SO HAVING A RAPID TRANSIT AS FAR AS LIKE FURTHER APART STOPS WITH,
YOU KNOW, DOESN'T AS A REGIONAL TRANSPORTATION NETWORK YOU'VE ALREADY GOT FRONTRUNNER. 
          SO IT MAKES SENSE IF YOU'RE GOING TO ADD CAPACITY TO ADD IT FURTHER WEST,
BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE YOU DON'T HAVE STUFF, RIGHT? YOU ALREADY GOT FRONTRUNNER AND IT WORKS PRETTY GOOD,
AS I CAN TELL. 
          I SAW A FRONTRUNNER TRAIN. SEE THAT? HERE'S HERE'S MY PROBLEM AND UTA WON'T LIKE. 
          I'M GOING TO HAVE TO SAY SO. SORRY. I'LL APOLOGIZE UP FRONT. 
          HERE'S THE PROBLEM THAT WE HAVE WITH MASS TRANSIT IN SALT LAKE COUNTY,
AND WE'RE TRYING TO TIE IT INTO UTAH COUNTY. 
          EVERYTHING IS DESIGNED TO GET TO DOWNTOWN SALT LAKE CITY. 
          I MEAN, YOU LOOK AT THE RED LINE. THE RED LINE IS DESIGNED TO GET THE DOWNTOWN SALT LAKE
CITY FROM, QUOTE UNQUOTE, THE SUBURBS. AND IT GETS YOU AND IT HELPS GET US TO THE YOU. 
          THE BLUE LINE RUNS FROM EAST AND DRAPER WHERE PEOPLE LIVE,
AND IT'S REALLY DESIGNED TO MOVE THE TRAFFIC TO DOWNTOWN SALT LAKE CITY. IF YOU LOOK AND BEEN THERE,
DONE THAT, WRITTEN HUNDREDS OF THEM. IF YOU LOOK AT THE JAPANESE MODEL, IT'S NOT ALL DESIGNED TO GET EVERYTHING INTO
DOWNTOWN TOKYO. IT'S DESIGNED TO GET AROUND TOKYO, THROUGH TOKYO ACROSS OSAKA TO THE NEXT LITTLE TRAIN STATION IN OSAKA, WHEREVER YOU'RE WHEREVER YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. 
          WHAT WE KEEP FOCUSING ON IS HOW DO WE GET TRAFFIC,
YOU KNOW, HOW DO WE? I MEAN, WE HAVEN'T EVEN SOLVED THE PROBLEM YET. 
          HOW DO WE GET TRAFFIC OUT OF THE BYU STADIUM ON A SATURDAY NIGHT? YOU EVER YOU EVER GONE TO A BYU GAME AND TRIED TO GET OUT OF THERE? I CAN'T STAND THAT. 
          WE SO THERE WHEREVER THERE'S THERE'S THERE'S NO THERE'S NO ADVANTAGE. 
          THERE'S NO ADVANTAGE BECAUSE WE HAVEN'T DESIGNED THE RAIL SYSTEM AS AS COUNCIL MEMBER
WHITELOCK SAYS, EVERYBODY SAYS IT'S. AND THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS,
IF I WANT TO RIDE TO A U OF U FOOTBALL GAME, IT'S AN HOUR PLUS TO DRIVE TO RIDE THE TRACKS FROM OVER HERE ALL THE WAY TO THE U. 
          [00:15:04]
AND AND SO WHY? WHILE I LIKE THE IDEA OF EXPANDING THE TRANSPORTATION,
WE'RE NOT BEING CREATIVE ENOUGH WITH WHAT WE'VE GOT. 
          FOR EXAMPLE, WHY DOES THE TRACK STATION, WHY DOES THE TRACKS TRAIN HAVE TO STOP AT EVERY
STATION AND JAPANESE AND THE JAPAN SYSTEM? YEAH, YOU'VE GOT THE TWO TRAIN STOPS AT EVERY STATION,
AND YOU KNOW, THAT'S GOING TO BE LONG, LAW, BUT THEY ALSO HAVE OTHER OTHER TRAINS THAT STOP. 
          AND SO IF YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A LIKE, LIKE ON GAME DAY AT YOU AT,
AT THE, AT UTAH. 
          YEAH, WE OUGHT TO BE ABLE TO GET ON TO THE RED LINE AND BE ABLE TO GET ON THE RED LINE AND
SAY, YOU KNOW WHAT THE RED LINE FOR GAME DAY FOR CERTAIN TRAINS STOPS AT CITY CENTER,
STOPS AT 53RD SOUTH, STOPS AT NINTH SOUTH, AND AND THEN IT STOPS AT THE YOU. 
          YEAH. TO MOVE PEOPLE. WHAT WE'RE WE'RE SO WHAT WE'VE WHAT WE'VE COME UP WITH IS AN
INHERENT CONFLICT BECAUSE COUNCIL MEMBER WHITELOCK'S RIGHT. IF IF I WENT GIVE YOU A PERFECT EXAMPLE,
I WENT I WENT ON A VACATION THIS WEEK. 
          NO WAY IN. THERE'S NO WAY WOULD I RIDE? WOULD I RIDE TRACKS TO THE AIRPORT? MEANS I HAVE TO DRIVE OVER TRACK STATION. I HAVE TO WAIT FOR A TRACKS TRAIN. 
          I HAVE TO GO LITERALLY DOWNTOWN BECAUSE THE RED LINE OR THE BLUE LINE GOES DOWNTOWN. 
          AND THAT'S WHERE YOU CAN MEET THE GREEN LINE. 
          AND THEN YOU GO WEST AND IT TAKES WHAT HOUR PLUS TO TO GO TO THE AIRPORT WHERE I CAN GET ON AT MY HOUSE, I CAN DRIVE OVER TO I-215 AND I'M IN THE AIRPORT 15
MINUTES. 
          YEAH. SO WHAT WE HAVE DONE IS WE HAVE NOT WE'VE,
WE'VE WE'VE MADE EVERYTHING. 
          I WILL TELL YOU THE AIRPORT LINE IS GREAT FOR TOURISTS. 
          IT'S TERRIBLE FOR MOST OF US. AND SO THE, THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS THAT IF WE'RE GOING
INTO SOMETHING LIKE THIS AND I KNOW IT'S AN OVERUSED TERM, BUT WE NEED A DIFFERENT PARADIGM,
AND THE PARADIGM IS NOT. 
          LET'S KEEP CONTINUING TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO GET PEOPLE FROM UTAH COUNTY TO DOWNTOWN
SALT LAKE, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT HONESTLY, THAT'S WHAT IT SOUNDS LIKE WE'RE TRYING TO DO. 
          AND WE GOT TO GIVE THEM A REASON NOT TO JUST WE GOTTA GIVE THEM A REASON TO STOP HERE. 
          THAT'S WHAT I'M WORKING ON. WELL, AND AND I AGREE BUT BUT BUT THAT BUT TO NOT JUST STOP
HERE. 
          BUT WHAT'S THE UTILITY I MEAN WE HAVE MORE WE HAVE MORE TRACKS. 
          WE HAVE AS MANY TRAX STATIONS OR MORE THAN ANY OTHER CITY IN THIS VALLEY. 
          BY THE TIME YOU GO FROM GARDNER VILLAGE ALL THE WAY OUT TO THE ONE AT OLD BINGHAM,
WHAT DO WE HAVE, 7 OR 8 OR. I DON'T KNOW SOMEBODY, I DON'T KNOW THE NUMBER,
BUT WE HAVE A BUNCH AND THEY'RE ALL DESIGNED TO GET PEOPLE FROM WEST JORDAN OUT. 
          AND THIS IS PART OF WHAT EXCITES ME ABOUT THIS,
IS THAT YOU SEE A LOT OF THESE. 
          IF YOU LOOK AT THOSE GRAY LINES, THESE ARE THE PIECES IN THAT VISION,
AND IT'S REALLY ABOUT EAST WEST. 
          THAT'S REALLY THE FOCUS IS SOUTHWEST, EAST WEST CONNECTIONS. 
          THERE'S A LOT OF WORK TO BE DONE ON THIS, BUT I DO THINK THAT THIS IS WHAT I HAVE
WITNESSED FROM THIS PARTNERSHIP IS THAT THEY'RE TRYING TO TRYING TO THINK ABOUT WHAT ARE THE KEY PLACES THAT WE WANT TO GET TO AND FROM IN THIS AREA,
AND HOW DO WE GET THERE. 
          SO I THINK YOUR COMMENTS ARE RIGHT ON THE MONEY,
AND I WOULD JUST ADD THAT I TOTALLY AGREE THAT THE OLD PARADIGM WAS ALWAYS BRINGING EVERYBODY TO THE CBD IN THE MORNING,
AND THAT BACK TO THE SUBURBS IN THE EVENING. 
          WE HAVE BEEN WORKING IN RECENT YEARS AND IT'S A,
YOU KNOW, IT'S A BIG SHIFT TO TURN RIGHT, TO THINK ABOUT OTHER THINGS. AND ONE REASONS THAT FRONT RUNNER FRONTRUNNER HAS BEEN SO
SUCCESSFUL IN RECOVERING AFTER, YOU KNOW, POST PANDEMIC, COMPARED TO A LOT OF OTHER AGENCIES AROUND THE COUNTRY IS IT HAS
BIDIRECTIONAL SERVICE THAT RUNS ALL DAY. 
          RIGHT. SO YOU HAVE PEOPLE GOING AS MANY PEOPLE GOING SOUTH IN UTAH COUNTY DURING THE DAY
AS YOU HAVE GOING NORTH TO SALT LAKE CITY. 
          RIGHT. IN SOME CASES. SO SO THAT'S PART OF IT. 
          WE ARE LOOKING AT WAYS THAT WE CAN CONNECT AS,
AS TED POINTED OUT, WHAT ARE THE RIGHT EAST WEST CONNECTIONS IF YOU LIVE IN WEST JORDAN BUT YOU WORK IN UTAH COUNTY, HOW CAN WE GET THAT CONNECTION? 
          [00:20:01]
BECAUSE WE KNOW AT THAT POINT THERE'S AS MANY PEOPLE COMING NORTH FOR JOBS AS GOING SOUTH
FOR JOBS. 
          SO IT'S KIND OF AN EVEN SPLIT AND VICE VERSA. 
          RIGHT. IF YOU WORK IN WEST JORDAN AND YOU LIVE IN EAGLE MOUNTAIN OR SOMETHING,
HOW CAN WE MAKE THAT WORK BETTER? RIGHT. SO THAT GOES TO COUNCIL MEMBER JACOB. IT WORKS BETTER IF WE HAVE IT OVER BY
MOUNTAIN VIEW THAN REDWOOD, BECAUSE HE'S EXACTLY RIGHT. AND THESE ARE STILL ALSO REALLY HIGH LEVEL. 
          LIKE WHAT ARE THINGS THAT WE COULD POTENTIALLY DIG INTO MORE IF WE REALLY WANT TO SERVE
THE SOUTHWEST QUADRANT AND IT NEEDS TO BE OVER BY MOUNTAIN VIEW. 
          OTHERWISE WE'RE JUST SERVING THE MIDDLE OF THE VALLEY AGAIN. 
          HAVE WHAT, OVER BY MOUNTAIN VIEW OR WHATEVER,
THE RAPID RAPID BUS THAT YOU ARE PROPOSING FOR REDWOOD. 
          ANY IDEA ON THIS ONE? JUST TO CLARIFY, IS BOTH TO HAVE ONE ON BOTH. 
          YEAH. I WANT TO DISAGREE SOMEWHAT WITH MY FELLOW COUNCIL MEMBERS IN THAT WHEN YOU ADD A
BUS, IN MY OPINION, YOU TAKE CARS OFF THE ROAD, THOSE CARS THAT ARE OFF THE ROAD AND NOW PEOPLE
ARE IN THE BUS WRITING, YOU CAN ACTUALLY IMPROVE TRAFFIC FLOW WITH A ESPECIALLY IF IT'S A USEFUL BUS LIKE THE ONE
ON REDWOOD ROAD WOULD BE, IN MY OPINION, EVEN IF IF EVEN THOUGH IT'S CLOSE TO FRONTRUNNER,
I THINK THERE WOULD BE A LOT OF DEMAND FOR REDWOOD ROAD BASED RAPID BUS. AND I THINK IT WOULD IMPROVE TRAFFIC ON REDWOOD ROAD,
NOT MAKE IT WORSE. 
          THAT'S JUST MY OPINION, THOUGH. I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING AT ALL TO BACK THAT UP. 
          THAT IS THE THEORY. SPEAKING OF ANYTHING AT ALL,
WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO SHOW? HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE, YOU KNOW, GETTING ON? AND BECAUSE WE DO HAVE BUSSES THAT ARE ON NOW. 
          WHAT KIND OF STUFF DO YOU HAVE THAT SHOWS? I CAN SPEAK TO REDWOOD ROAD,
PASSES, THE REDWOOD ROAD BUS, THE MOST POPULAR BUS IN WEST JORDAN, AND DURING THE RUSH HOURS THEY GET FULL AND THEY
SOMETIMES TWO, TWO BUSSES, THEY LEAPFROG EACH OTHER BECAUSE THEY GET REALLY FULL. 
          THAT'S WHERE THE HIGHEST USED BUS LINES IT IS THE HIGHEST IN WEST JORDAN IS ONE OF THE
HIGHEST ONES FOR UTA. 
          IT'S ONLY ONE IN WEST JORDAN THAT GOES THE ONLY ONE IN WEST JORDAN THAT REALLY GOES
ANYWHERE. 
          YEAH. AS MAYOR BIRD POINTED OUT, THE IT'S THE THE ROUTE THROUGHOUT 217 THAT GOES BETWEEN
WEST JORDAN, GOES UP TO NORTH TEMPLE TRACK STATION, YOU KNOW,
AND EVERY PLACE IN BETWEEN THAT IS ONE OF OUR HIGHEST RIDERSHIP AND ALSO HIGHEST NUMBER OF PEOPLE PER HOUR RIDING ON A BUS IN OUR ENTIRE BUS NETWORK. 
          WE DID JUST RECENTLY IMPLEMENT ROUTE 219 THAT GOES FARTHER SOUTH ON REDWOOD ROAD. 
          THAT IS NOT GETTING HUGE RIDERSHIP YET, BUT IT TAKES A WHILE FOR A BUS SYSTEM TO MATURE
AND START ATTRACTING RIDERSHIP. 
          BUT I THINK IT IS VALID THAT AT LEAST IN CERTAIN SECTIONS OF REDWOOD THAT ARE ARE FAIRLY
WELL BUILT OUT, HAVE A LOT OF THINGS NEAR IT, IT'S ALREADY ATTRACTING A LOT OF RIDERS WITH THE CURRENT
SYSTEM. 
          I WOULD LIKE TO POINT OUT ONE OTHER THING THAT UTA HAS PARTICULARLY DIFFICULT JOB IN
PROVIDING SERVICES FOR A POPULATION THAT IS SO SPARSE AND SPREAD OUT. 
          COMPARED TO JAPAN. I'VE. AND WHEN I LOOKED AT MY EXPERIENCES IN EUROPE USING MASS TRANSIT
AND THE DENSITY OF POPULATION IS BEYOND WHAT WE CAN EVEN IMAGINE. 
          AND AND THAT DENSITY PROVIDES MONEY AND IT PROVIDES USE. 
          AND IT ALSO IS NOT CAR FRIENDLY. IT IS ABSOLUTELY NOT CAR FRIENDLY. 
          SO MOST PEOPLE IN EUROPE AND PROBABLY JAPAN AS WELL,
I DON'T KNOW ABOUT JAPAN, BUT MOST PEOPLE DON'T HAVE CARS. 
          SO I THINK THE THE UTA IS IN AN EXTREMELY DIFFICULT POSITION,
PROVIDING MUCH NEEDED SERVICES WITH VERY LITTLE MONEY COMPARED TO THE KIND OF POPULATION THAT WE HAVE TO SUPPORT IT. 
          SO. BUT EVEN IF YOU LOOK AT THE TRANSIT SYSTEMS LIKE THE METRO IN DC,
EVEN A LOT OF THEM ARE DESIGNED TO TO GET PEOPLE INTO DC. BUT I CAN GUARANTEE YOU THAT WHEN I GO TO DC ANYMORE,
AND IT'S BEEN SEVERAL TIMES IN DC, I DON'T EVEN RENT A CAR ANYMORE BECAUSE I CAN I CAN SEE IS ALSO ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE
MORE DENSE THAN. 
          WELL IT IS, BUT BUT BUT FAIRFAX COUNTY IN A LOT OF AREAS ISN'T RIGHT. 
          BUT YOU'RE WHEN YOU GO TO DC YOU'RE NOT GOING TO FAIRFAX COUNTY. YOU'RE GOING TO. OH BUT
BUT I CAN GET TO I CAN GET FROM I CAN GET FROM CRYSTAL CITY TO FAIRFAX. 
          [00:25:04]
I CAN GET TO RESTON, I CAN GET TO PLACES ON THE METRO AND NOT HAVE TO GO INTO DOWNTOWN DC, NOT TO GO INTO DOWNTOWN DC TO DO IT IF I WANT TO,
IF I WANT TO GO OVER TO TO PARTS IN MARYLAND OR OTHER PLACES. 
          I CAN DO IT WITHOUT BECAUSE THE WAY THEY'VE ARRANGED THE THE METRO AND INTERSECTED IT. 
          AND UNFORTUNATELY, WHAT WE'VE DONE IS WE'VE BUILT OUR RAIL SYSTEM BASED ON THE OLD,
THE OLD RIGHT OF WAY, THE RAIL RIGHT OF WAYS. AND THE MINDSET WHEN WE PUT IN TRACKS 20 YEARS AGO WAS OR WHATEVER
IT WAS 20, 30 YEARS AGO WAS LET'S GET THE TRAFFIC INTO SALT LAKE. 
          AND AS YOU SAY, IT'S A BIG SHIFT. AND SO ANYWAY,
SO I'M INTRIGUED BY YOUR EAST WEST BECAUSE THAT IS A BIG CONCERN IN OUR CITY. SO WHEN I LOOKED AT THE OTHER MAP THAT WAS UP THERE WITH THE GRAY,
I DIDN'T REALLY SEE WEST JORDAN WITH MUCH EAST WEST. 
          YEAH. AND THAT IS THAT'S NOT BECAUSE WE DON'T CARE ABOUT WEST JORDAN. 
          IT'S JUST THE FOCUS GEOGRAPHICALLY OF THIS STUDY IS FURTHER SOUTH. 
          I DO WANT TO HIGHLIGHT THAT THERE IS A DRAFT PLAN THAT INCLUDES MORE IDEAS IN WEST JORDAN
AND POINTS NORTH. 
          THAT'S PART OF THE REGIONAL TRANSPORTATION PLAN. 
          AND THERE'S A WORKSHOP THAT COUNCIL AND COMMISSION AND KEY STAFF WILL BE INVITED TO JUST
THIS FALL, AND I CAN FIND THE DATE. AND IF I CAN'T FIND THE DATE,
I WILL GET IT TO YOUR RECORDER AND WE'LL SEND IT OUT TO YOU JUST TOMORROW SO THAT YOU'VE GOT THAT. AND YOU'RE AVAILABLE. YOU'RE AWARE OF THAT,
BUT. 
          SO THAT WILL INCLUDE MORE TRANSIT IDEAS THAT GO WITH THIS. 
          SO THIS THIS IS A FOCUS IN THE GEOGRAPHY THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT. 
          YOU KNOW, IT IS IT IS WHAT IT IS. BUT IT'S NOT THE TOTALITY. 
          RIGHT. WELL IT'S REALLY NOT. THIS IS FROM WEST JORDAN POINTS SOUTH. 
          WE WE BARELY YEAH. WE'RE NOT HARDLY BARELY QUALIFIED TO BE INVOLVED IN THIS BECAUSE IT'S
JUST WE'RE THE STARTING POINT OF OF OF THE DISCUSSION NOT YOU KNOW. YEAH. IT'S NOT REALLY TO SERVICE GETTING AROUND WEST JORDAN,
MR. JEROME, BUT ASIDE FROM THAT, IT DOESN'T SEEM TO. 
          CAN I ASK A QUESTION ABOUT. SURE. I'VE HEARD THAT THERE HAVE BEEN PLANS OR IDEAS OF
EXTENDING THE RED LINE SOUTH FROM SOUTH JORDAN INTO HARRIMAN AND THEN OVER TO THE FRONTRUNNER. 
          AND THAT'S THAT IS PART OF THIS VERY EFFORT. AND THEN I'LL JUST I'LL JUST CLARIFY AGAIN
THAT LET'S SAY HYPOTHETICALLY, BECAUSE I, I'M NOT GOING TO SPEAK FOR THE PARTNERSHIP,
BUT LET'S SAY HYPOTHETICALLY, THEY THINK, LOOK, THIS ROUGHLY REFLECTS THE DIRECTION THAT WE WANT TO GO. 
          THEN WHAT YOU'D BE LOOKING AT IS NOT A PLAN TO MAKE IT HAPPEN. 
          IT'S A THIS IS A STATEMENT OF WHAT WE WANT TO TRY TO ACCOMPLISH. 
          AND THEN WE HAVE TO UNPACK. ARE WE READY TO DO A,
B, C, D TO MAKE IT HAPPEN? SOME OF THESE ARE A HUGE LIFT AND SOME OF THEM ARE MORE NEARER TERM PROSPECTS. 
          TRACKS. TRACKS WOULD BE A HUGE THE TRACKS LINE WOULD BE A VERY SIGNIFICANT LIFT. 
          VERY SIGNIFICANT. THE BUS RAPID TRANSIT CONCEPT ON REDWOOD ROAD WOULD BE MUCH LESS OF A
LIFT. 
          YOU AS A COMMUNITY WOULD BE A BIG PART OF DEFINING. 
          WHAT WOULD THAT LOOK LIKE? WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE TO DO RELATIVE TO THAT KIND OF OPPORTUNITY? YOU'D HAVE A LOT OF CONTROL OVER THAT ABOUT,
YOU KNOW, HOW HOW AGGRESSIVE, HOW FAST, HOW MUCH CHANGE TO LAND DEVELOPMENT. 
          THAT'S THOSE ARE YOUR DECISIONS. A LOT OF THEM I MEAN,
THERE'S REDWOOD, REDWOOD ROAD ITSELF AS A ROAD. 
          IS IT POSSIBLE YOU SAID THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT DOING BOTH REDWOOD AND MOUNTAIN VIEW? IS IT POSSIBLE IN MOUNTAIN VIEW TO MAYBE HAVE SOME KIND OF A RAPID BUS LINE IN THE MIDDLE
OF THE NORTH AND SOUTH BOUND LANES? IS THAT A POSSIBILITY? I, I THINK THAT THAT'S ACTUALLY THE CONCEPT THAT IS AT LEAST
INITIALLY BEING EXPLORED. 
          BUT AT THIS POINT IT'S CONCEPTUAL AND THERE'D BE A LOT MORE DETAIL,
DETAILED WORK THAT WOULD GO INTO DECIDING HOW THAT MIGHT BE DEPLOYED. 
          BUT I THINK THAT YOUR IDEA THERE IS, IS IN THE IN THE SPACE OF WHAT IS CURRENTLY BEING
CONSIDERED AT A CONCEPTUAL LEVEL, IT JUST SEEMS THAT WOULD BE LESS THAN IT'S ALREADY BEEN PART OF THE PLAN FOREVER,
RIGHT? HASN'T IT? NO, IT'S BEEN TO HAVE IT GO UP 5600. 
          YEAH. OKAY. NOW WE'RE SO WE'RE GOING TO AND THIS IS JUST ON THE SOUTHBOUND. 
          SO IF YOU'RE SPEAKING ABOUT NORTH, NORTH OF THIS AREA THAT THAT'S NOT CURRENTLY
CONTEMPLATED AT LEAST IN THE DRAFT PLANS. 
          SO IT WOULD JUST BE THIS SEGMENT HEADING SOUTHBOUND,
THIS DARK RED LINE THAT YOU SEE. 
          [00:30:05]
YEAH. WHERE MOUNTAIN VIEW IS NOT ALREADY BUT I. 
          I KNOW, BUT THEY COULD STILL LOOK AT IT. BUT KILLEEN'S KILLEEN'S COULD GO FROM THE AIRPORT
TO UTAH COUNTY. 
          IF WE DID A RAPID BUS IN BETWEEN TO, TO, TO KILLEEN'S POINT,
THEY'RE GOING TO BE STARTING WORKING ON THE SOUTH END AND MOUNTAIN VIEW AREA AND, AND AND BRINGING THE,
YOU KNOW, AND AND TURNING IT INTO THE FREEWAY AND ELIMINATING THE, THE GRADE CROSSINGS AND ALL THAT OTHER STUFF. 
          IF WE DON'T LOOK NOW WITH UDOT TO FIX THAT, ALL WE'RE GOING TO DO IS FILL IN THE ASPHALT
AND WE'RE NOT WE'RE GOING TO MISS THE OPPORTUNITY FOR MASS TRANSIT. I, I THINK THAT IF I MISSED THAT, THAT WAS THE POINT THAT I GOT FROM YOU IS THAT
WE'VE GOT TO START PLANNING NOW WITH THE EXPANSION OF MOUNTAIN VIEW, THAT IF WE WANT MASS TRANSIT DONE RIGHT, LIKE LIKE SOME OF THOSE BUS WAS IT SOUTHERN
CALIFORNIA THAT'S GOT THE BUS LANES THAT YOU CAN GET ON AND OFF, AND THEY HAVE THE SPECIAL LANE THAT HAS IT. YEAH,
LA'S GOT THAT. 
          SO YEAH, I'LL TAKE THAT. POINT FROM THIS MEETING AND TAKE IT BACK TO OUR TEAM. 
          I DON'T WANT TO OVER PROMISE BECAUSE WE DID A LOT OF PROJECT IDEA GATHERING INPUT OVER THE
LAST YEAR, AND WE, WE PUT THAT TIME FRAME TO BED. IT'S ALWAYS. 
          IT'S NEVER CLOSED PERMANENTLY. I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY. 
          WE CAN TAKE THAT IDEA, PUT IT IN THE MIX, BUT IT'S NOT PROBABLY GOING TO SHOW UP ON THE
MAPS THAT YOU WILL LOOK AT THIS FALL. 
          I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY, BUT I'VE GOT IT AND I WILL RELAY IT AND WE'LL TAKE A LOOK AT IT
AND START TO EXPLORE IT. 
          IT JUST MIGHT BE A LITTLE WHILE. AND ANOTHER THING TO JUST KEEP IN MIND IS THERE'S A
DEMOGRAPHIC COMPONENT TO WHO RIDES BUS US AND WHO WRITES ON A DAILY BASIS. AND IT'S YOUR HARRIMAN'S AND RIVERTON'S AND AND EAGLE MOUNTAIN'S AND SARATOGA
SPRINGS IS LESS LIKELY TO RIDE A BUS ON A, ON A DAILY BASIS ON A, ON A NEEDS BASIS THAN YOUR WEST VALLEY'S AND CURBS AND YOU KNOW
IT'S THERE'S A DEMOGRAPHIC COMPONENT THERE. 
          BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE IF IT'S AN INCOME BASED COMPONENT OR WHAT IT IS. 
          JUST PEOPLE ARE MORE LIKELY TO HAVE A CAR THE FURTHER OUT OF INTO SUBURBIA THAT YOU ARE. 
          SO THERE'S A LOT MORE CAR DRIVING HAPPENING UNLESS,
YOU KNOW, THERE'S THERE'S LESS OF A OF A NECESSITY, THERE'S MORE DEPENDENCY ON CARS FURTHER. YOU'RE SPREAD OUT. 
          YEAH. RIGHT. AND THERE'S LESS AND AND THERE'S LESS OF A,
OF A, OF A INCENTIVE TO WANT TO GET ON A BUS. 
          RIGHT. OR TO WANT TO LIVE IN A SITUATION WHERE YOU DON'T HAVE A CAR THAT'S GOING TO BE AN
URBAN CENTER, THAT'S GOING TO BE OR OUR CLOSE IN. YOU KNOW,
CLOSE. 
          CLOSE TO URBAN CENTER SUBURBIA. BUT THE FURTHER YOU GET OUT,
THE MORE YOU GET PEOPLE THAT HAVE CARS. 
          THAT'S JUST GAINING MORE AND MORE PEOPLE IN ALL THESE PLACES. 
          SO IT'S NO LONGER GOING TO REALLY BE THE BIG SUBURBAN,
BECAUSE WE'RE BUILDING TOWNHOMES AND MULTIFAMILY EVERYWHERE. 
          THAT'S STILL SUBURBAN. AND IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT INCOME,
THEN THE INCOME IS LOWER. 
          AND SO AND TO ME, THE WHOLE PURPOSE THAT YOU BUILD A TRANSIT SYSTEM IS TO GET PEOPLE TO
RIDE IT AND, AND NOT TAKE THEIR CAR. SO I DON'T WANT TO DISCOUNT DOING THE RIGHT THING FOR THE RIGHT
REASON BASED ON GEOGRAPHIC LOCATION WHERE YOU LIVE. RIGHT. YOU CAN'T BASE IT ON WHAT'S NOW YOU'RE PLANNING
FOR THE FUTURE. 
          EXACTLY RIGHT, A BRIGHTER FUTURE. A LOT OF PEOPLE COMPLAIN ABOUT PEOPLE WHO MOSTLY DRIVE
CARS, COMPLAIN ABOUT ALL THE MONEY THAT'S SPENT ON MASS TRANSIT. 
          AND I AND BUT THEY DO THEY DO USE IT. THEY JUST DON'T REALIZE IS NOT ON A CAR. 
          SO ANYWAY, I THINK IT'S GREAT THE DATE OF THAT GONDOLA,
YOU KNOW. 
          YEAH. I'LL TAKE THAT IDEA. SO LET'S NOT GO THERE. 
          YEAH. THE GONDOLA. OKAY, OVER TO THE MEETING THAT I WAS,
AND I AND I CAN I CAN WRAP THIS UP. 
          UNLESS YOU'D LIKE TO TALK ABOUT ANY OTHER QUESTIONS THAT YOU MIGHT HAVE. 
          BUT HOW ABOUT YOU FINISH? AND THEN IF WE HAVE QUESTIONS,
WE'LL ALLOW A FEW MINUTES FOR THOSE. 
          SO THIS IS NEARING NEARING WRAP UP. WE HAVE THE MEETING ON MONDAY TO FOCUS ON THE VISION
WITH THE SALT LAKE COUNTY GROUP OF PARTNERS. THEN WE'LL EXPLORE AND ARTICULATE SOME OF THE STEPS TO MAKE THOSE LINES 
          [00:35:06]
FUNCTION AND GET IMPLEMENTED. MONEY. MAYBE DEVELOPMENT THINGS OF THIS TYPE. 
          AND WE'D BE HAPPY TO SHARE THAT WITH YOU IF YOU'D LIKE US TO COME BACK. 
          BUT YOU'LL GET A COPY OF THAT AT A MINIMUM. AND,
YOU KNOW, WHATEVER IS HELPFUL TO YOU, WE CAN DO. 
          AND WE DON'T HAVE TO HAVE IT REVOLVE AROUND THIS STUDY. 
          WE CAN TALK ABOUT TRANSPORTATION NEEDS AND ISSUES HERE IN THE CITY INCLUDING PUBLIC
TRANSPORTATION, AS YOU WOULD LIKE. BUT THE MEETING THAT I WAS REFERENCING IS ON NOVEMBER 6TH,
AND THAT IS FOCUSED AROUND THIS AREA. 
          AND IT'S LOOKING AT IT WILL INCLUDE THESE IDEAS,
BUT IT WILL INCLUDE OTHER IDEAS ROAD, TRANSIT AND TRAIL. 
          AND WOULD LOVE TO SEE YOU THERE NOVEMBER 6TH. 
          THAT SHOULD ALREADY BE ON YOUR CALENDARS. AND IF IT ISN'T,
IT'S GOING TO BE GOING OUT SHORTLY. 
          IT'S LIKE A WHOLE LOT OF LAYOUT. YEAH. AND THANK YOU. 
          I APPRECIATE THE THE OPPORTUNITY TO BE HERE. AND THANKS A LOT FOR YOUR FEEDBACK. 
          THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE. ANY FINAL QUESTIONS FOR MR. KNOWLTON? THANK YOU. ALRIGHT. THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME. 
          OKAY. THE NEXT ITEM ON OUR AGENDA IS A DISCUSSION OF AMENDMENTS TO TITLE FOUR,
CHAPTER TWO, 
          [b.
 Discussion of Amendments to Title 4, Chapter 2, Article D (Home Occupations)]
HOME OCCUPATIONS. MR. BOYCE, CAN YOU USE THAT PEN? THAT. YES. YEAH, YEAH. RED. RED AND BLUE SO THAT WE CAN TRACK ALL OUR CHANGES. 
          SO WE THIS IS THE SECOND TIME THAT WE'VE BEEN HERE FOR DISCUSSION. 
          ON THIS PARTICULAR ITEM I WENT THROUGH THE NOTES IN MEETING MINUTES FROM THE LAST TIME
THAT WE DISCUSSED AND MADE SOME ADJUSTMENTS TO THE PROPOSED CODE. THOSE ARE IN YOUR FILE ON THE LEGISLATIVE. 
          COPY. NOT A TON OF CHANGES IS NOTED IN THE RCA,
BUT THERE ARE A COUPLE OF MAIN ONES. OBVIOUSLY THE FEE THE COUNCIL THERE WAS A MAJORITY OF THE COUNCIL
THAT DIDN'T WANT ANY FEE, NOT EVEN AN APPLICATION FEE FOR A HOME OCCUPATION LICENSE. 
          AND THEN WE I DID ADD A SECTION IN HERE WITH REGARDS TO AN APPEAL. 
          THAT WAS KIND OF SOMETHING THAT I KNOW THE COUNCIL HAS DISCUSSED BEFORE THAT WE WANT TO
USE THE ALJ FOR APPEALS. 
          SO THAT WAS JUST ADDED AT THE END OF SECTION 42D1E. 
          I JUST MADE SURE TO CLARIFY THAT ANY APPEALS ON WHETHER OR NOT A HOME OCCUPATION IS FOUND
TO HAVE AN OFF SITE IMPACT WOULD BE HEARD BY THE ALJ. SO THOSE ARE KIND OF THE TWO MAIN AREAS THAT WERE MODIFIED FOR
THE LAST TIME THAT WE WERE HERE. 
          SO SPEAKING OF BLUE AND RED, YEAH, BLUE IS ADDING THINGS IN AND RED IS TAKING THINGS AWAY. 
          RIGHT. THAT'S I THINK WHAT WE GOT. YEAH. SO SO IT'S KIND OF LIKE THE AP TOP 25 POLL THIS
WEEK. 
          THAT'S. ABSOLUTELY. SORRY. WAS THAT TOO SOON? YEAH. SORRY. NO, THAT'S. THAT'S FAIR. I COULDN'T RESIST. 
          WOW. VERY FAIR, VERY FAIR. THEY BELONG THERE. 
          SO SORRY. SO, ANYWAY, I DIDN'T KNOW IF THE COUNCIL WANTED TO DISCUSS ANY ANY ADDITIONAL
IDEAS. 
          THERE WAS SOME DISCUSSION AT THE LAST MEETING ABOUT WHETHER ALL HOME OCCUPATIONS IMPACT OR NOT SHOULD SHOULD GET A LICENSE. 
          AND, AND IN THAT WAY, YOU KNOW, WE KIND OF KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON. 
          WELL, CAN I INTERRUPT? YEAH. SO SOME NOT NON IMPACT HOME OCCUPATIONS REQUIRE THE BUSINESS
LICENSE FOR THEIR OWN PURPOSES, NOT EVEN AT THE CITY LEVEL TO BUY INSURANCE OR. 
          YEAH, OR OPEN A BANK ACCOUNT. A GREAT EXAMPLE. 
          SO ANYWAY, I THINK IT'S, I THINK IT'S GOOD TO INCENTIVIZE THAT AND ALLOW IT TO HAPPEN
BECAUSE WE'RE ALREADY. 
          WE'RE ALREADY NOT REQUIRING ANY FEES FOR IMPACT FOR. 
          RIGHT. YEAH. WHAT WHAT WE'RE DOING IS WE'RE NOT REQUIRING THERE'S NO LICENSE FEE. 
          [00:40:05]
IF SOMEBODY CHARGED, IF SOMEBODY REQUIRED TO GET A LICENSE FOR THEIR HOME OCCUPATION. 
          YEAH. WE'RE NOT WE'RE NOT CHARGING THEM. WE'RE NOT CHARGING THEM A LICENSE FEE. 
          BUT BUT THEY'RE BUT THEY'RE STILL DOING AN APPLICATION FEE FOR THE PROCESSING. 
          IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING MR. HUDSON'S HERE TO $55 APPLICATION FEE. 
          WE WAIVE THE $40 LICENSING FEE. LAST TIME I APPLIED FOR ONE,
I DIDN'T PAY ANYTHING. 
          WE NEED TO TALK. YEAH. THAT'S RIGHT. OKAY. YOU'RE GOING TO GET AN INVOICE TOMORROW. 
          OKAY, I'M GETTING A SHAKE. SHAKE DOWN RIGHT HERE. 
          YEAH. YOU'RE. YOU'RE NOT LEAVING TONIGHT WITHOUT OUR $2. 
          BUT BUT THAT'S I THINK THAT'S THAT'S PART OF THE DISCUSSION IS IF,
IF WE DO WE REQUIRE IT. 
          DO WE ALLOW IT? DO WE CHARGE THE FEE? APPLICATION FEE ACROSS THE BOARD? DO WE CHARGE NO APPLICATION FEE ACROSS THE BOARD? STATE CODE DOESN'T ALLOW US TO CHARGE LIKE A LICENSING FEE FOR A NON IMPACT. 
          SO THAT'S THAT'S NOT AN ISSUE THAT'S BEEN ADJUDICATED AT ALL AS TO WHETHER THE APPLICATION
FEE IS MATERIALLY THE SAME AS A BUSINESS LICENSE FEE. 
          I THINK THE STATE CODE SPECIFICALLY SAYS THAT WE CAN CHARGE AN APPLICATION FEE. 
          SO I JUST MY PERSONAL OPINION IS FOR, FOR MOST FOR MOST HOME OCCUPATIONS. 
          IF, IF THEY IF THEY WANT A LICENSE, IF THEY IF THEY NEED A LICENSE,
LIKE MY WIFE NEEDS HER BUSINESS LICENSE. 
          WITH THE NEED. THE THE NEED IS TO PROVE THAT SHE'S A LEGITIMATE BUSINESS AND NOT JUST
FLYING BY NIGHT. 
          RIGHT. YOU PROBABLY DO THIS. YOU HAVE THE SAME THING WITH SOME OF YOUR PHOTOGRAPHY WORK. 
          YEAH, I JUST DON'T THINK WE OUGHT TO BE CHARGING FOR THAT. 
          AND, AND AND AND I DON'T LIKE THE. AND IF WE DO CHARGE AN APPLICATION FEE,
IT HAS TO BE. 
          I DON'T EVEN WANT TO CHARGE AN APPLICATION FEE THERE TO,
TO BE TO, TO BE HONEST WITH YOU. 
          I MEAN, I'LL GIVE YOU I GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE SOMETIME 10 OR 12 HOURS AGO,
I DON'T KNOW WHEN IT WAS DUE TO ALL THE TIME ZONES. 
          I'M, I'M SITTING IN THE HONOLULU INTERNATIONAL AIRPORT AND THERE'S A GUY. 
          THERE'S THERE'S JUST THERE'S A GUY JUST SITTING DOWN THERE,
AND WE ENDED UP TALKING, AND IT TURNS OUT HE'S COMING BACK TO SALT LAKE. 
          BUT HE USED TO LIVE JUST DOWN THE STREET ON REDWOOD ROAD. 
          AND AND IT WAS FUNNY BECAUSE HIS KIDS WENT TO WEST JORDAN AND MY KID,
AND THEY PLAYED FOOTBALL. 
          WE NEW FOOTBALL COACH TALKED ABOUT THAT A COUPLE OTHER THINGS. 
          HERE'S THE INTERESTING THING HE SAID. AND THIS IS THE THE POINT IS,
IS THAT HE HAD A DAUGHTER WHO CREATED SOME SORT OF BUSINESS. I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT WAS, SOME GRAPHIC DESIGN BUSINESS OR SOME DAMN
THING IN HIS BASEMENT HERE IN WEST JORDAN. IT GOT SO SUCCESSFUL, SHE WAS ABLE TO SELL THE BUSINESS FOR $20 MILLION. 
          AND YOU DON'T WANT 55 BUCKS FOR THAT. IF THEY SOLD THE. 
          IF THEY SOLD THE BUSINESS FOR $20 MILLION. GREAT. 
          LET'S CHARGE THEM. LET'S CHARGE THEM A SALES FEE. 
          BUT FOR THEM TO GET OFF THE OFF THE GROUND AND BE THE INCUBATOR. 
          AND IF WE'RE DOING A LOT OF THESE BUSINESSES AND PEOPLE'S HOMES AND THOSE KIND OF THINGS. 
          I DON'T WANT ANYTHING FROM THE CITY TO GET IN THE WAY OF. 
          BEING TO TO ADDRESS THE ENTREPRENEUR THAT'S TRYING TO DO SOMETHING IN THEIR BASEMENT OR IN
THEIR BACK GARAGE. I MEAN, WE ALL KNOW THAT, YOU KNOW, WE ALL KNOW THAT THE THE STEVE JOBS,
THE STEVE JOBS, APPLE, APPLE STORY, YOU KNOW, THAT IT STARTED IN THE GARAGE. 
          BUT, YOU KNOW, THOSE ARE THE KIND OF THINGS THAT I DON'T WANT TO PUT ANY HINDRANCE AT ALL. 
          BUT IS THERE ANY IF THERE'S NOT AN IMPACT THEY DON'T HAVE TO HAVE A BUSINESS LICENSE
CURRENTLY. 
          RIGHT. BUT BUT BUT BUT IF THEY'RE DOING GOVERNMENT SALES THEY MAY NEED A BUSINESS LICENSE. 
          SO WHY ARE WE CHARGING THEM THE APPLICATION FEE? MY THOUGHT ON THIS IS THAT IF THEY'RE DOING SOMETHING THAT THEY FEEL THEY NEED A BUSINESS
LICENSE, THEN THEY PROBABLY PUT TOGETHER THE WORK OF DOING A BUSINESS PLAN AND PUTTING THINGS
TOGETHER. 
          AND PART OF THAT IS A SMALL FEE. IF THEY NEED A BUSINESS LICENSE AND WE HAVE TO SUPPLY IT
TO MAKE IT LEGITIMATE. 
          AND PART OF THAT LEGITIMACY IS A SLIGHT PAYMENT,
OR ELSE IT ISN'T A LEGITIMATE BUSINESS LICENSE IF IT'S JUST WE'RE PHOTOCOPYING THEM OFF. 
          IF YOU WANT TO MAKE IT LEGITIMATE, IT NEEDS TO HAVE SOME LEGITIMACY. 
          I'M NOT SAYING WE NEED TO. WE COULD BRING THE PRICE DOWN,
I DON'T CARE. BUT IF THERE'S WORK FROM OUR STAFF TO GO INTO SOMETHING, 
          [00:45:08]
THEN THERE TO MAKE IT LEGITIMATE, THEN WE MAKE IT LEGITIMATE WITH A SLIGHT PAY. 
          AGAIN, I DON'T CARE HOW MUCH IT IS, BUT AND THE POINT IS,
MAKE IT LEGITIMATE. 
          THE POINT IS, IS OUR STAFF DOESN'T WORK FOR FREE,
NO MATTER WHO'S, NO MATTER WHAT. 
          SO IT'S EITHER THE PERSON APPLYING FOR THE BUSINESS LICENSE PAYS THE FEE,
OR OUR TAXPAYER PAYS THE FEE. 
          YEAH, BUT I THINK THE FIRST QUESTION IS PROBABLY WHAT PATRICK WAS ASKING. 
          DO WE WANT TO REQUIRE EVERY BUSINESS TO HAVE A BUSINESS LICENSE? I THINK THAT WE NEED TO ANSWER FIRST IMPACT OR NOT? YEAH, BECAUSE IF WE DO, THEN THEN MAYBE IT'S A DIFFERENT DISCUSSION. 
          ALTHOUGH I TEND TO AGREE WITH BOTH VICE CHAIR AND COUNCIL MEMBER JACOB. 
          PERSONALLY, I I'M PRETTY FRUGAL AND IF I'M GOING TO START A BUSINESS,
I'M GOING TO BE ABLE TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO PONY UP THAT $55. I MEAN, WE CHARGE 50 BUCKS IN PROFIT, AND OUR AND OUR STAFF ARE. 
          ARE CONTRIBUTING TO THEIR BUSINESS BY PERFORMING A SERVICE. 
          AND I'D LIKE A PASSPORT FOR FREE, TOO, BUT AND IF I GO DOWN THERE,
I HAVE TO PAY THEM $200. 
          IF THEY HAVE A BUSINESS THAT DOESN'T NEED A BUSINESS LICENSE,
THEN THEY'RE GOING ALONG THE WAY. 
          THEY'RE GOING RIGHT NOW. BUT THAT'S WHY WE NEED TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION FIRST. 
          IF YOU'RE RUNNING A BUSINESS AND I KNOW, BUT WHAT DO WE WANT OUR CODE TO SAY? DO WE WANT OUR CODE TO SAY IF YOU'RE RUNNING A BUSINESS,
HANG ON THERE. 
          IF YOU'RE RUNNING A BUSINESS IN WEST JORDAN. YOU SHALL OR YOU CAN'T. 
          WHAT'S THE LAW? WELL, THAT'S WHAT PATRICK'S ASKING. 
          I'VE HAD A BUSINESS LICENSE IN LOTS OF DIFFERENT COMMUNITIES,
AND I HAVEN'T EVER FELT THAT I SHOULDN'T HAVE HAD TO PAY TO HAVE A BUSINESS LICENSE. 
          IT ALWAYS FELT LIKE I SHOULD. BUT IN ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTION,
MY THOUGHT IS THE CITY SHOULD REQUIRE A BUSINESS LICENSE FOR ANY BUSINESS HOME OCCUPATION. 
          THAT WOULD BE VERY HELPFUL IF WHEN THE RESIDENT CALLS AND SAYS,
HEY, MY NEIGHBOR IS DOING XYZ NEXT DOOR. 
          DO THEY HAVE A LICENSE TO DO THAT? AND THAT WOULD GIVE US AN OPPORTUNITY TO RESEARCH AND
KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON. 
          IF POLICE GET A CALL OUT THERE, IF FIRE GETS CALLED OUT THERE,
THEY'D HAVE AN IDEA SOMETHING MIGHT BE GOING ON THERE. 
          WHETHER THEY'RE MAKING DONUTS, MAKING A COMPUTER,
MAKING A BIRTHDAY CAKE, WHATEVER IT IS. 
          THAT WOULD BE VERY HELPFUL FOR US TO KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING IN THAT RESIDENCE. 
          NOW, WHETHER WE CHARGE OR NOT, BOTH THESE QUESTIONS ARE UP TO THE COUNCIL,
BUT THAT THAT'S THAT'S MY PERSPECTIVE. 
          SEE, I JUST I DON'T LIKE THE IDEA OF LICENSING EVERY HOME BASED BUSINESS. 
          THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS, IS THAT WHEN ALTHOUGH THERE'S SOME SPECIFIC EXCLUSIONS FOR KIDS
WHO ARE DOING. 
          LEMONADE STANDS THERE ARE SOME SPECIFIC EXCLUSIONS THAT IN THAT IN STATE STATUTE FROM WHAT
I REMEMBER. 
          BUT YOU KNOW, IF SOMEBODY IF SOMEBODY'S. DOING. 
          MARY KAY PAPARAZZI, AVON WHATEVER THE THE HECK THAT THOSE KIND OF TECHNICALLY THEY ARE ALL
BUSINESSES AND THEY ALL REQUIRE A BUSINESS LICENSE. I MEAN,
WE COULD BE INUNDATED. 
          I MEAN, I THINK WE ALSO HAVE TO TAKE THE FACT THAT WE HAVE VERY LIMITED STAFF. 
          AND IF WE SAY EVERYBODY HAS TO HAVE A HOME BASED BUSINESS AND SOMEHOW,
FIRST OFF, I THINK IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO ENFORCE. 
          AND IF IT'S A LOW IMPACT ONE, LIKE LET'S SAY MARY KAY AND SOMEBODY DOESN'T GET A LICENSE,
ARE WE GOING TO ENFORCE THAT? ARE WE GOING TO SEND CODE ENFORCEMENT? ARE WE GOING TO CITE THEM FOR OH,
YOU'RE SELLING MARY KAY. 
          BECAUSE IT'S TUPPERWARE. OKAY. IF IT'S TUPPERWARE OKAY. 
          THAT'S DIFFERENT. BUT YOU KNOW THAT MY POINT IS,
IS THERE'S A POINT WHERE IN A IN A CITY AS LARGE AS WEST JORDAN. 
          YEAH. IF WE HAD A STAFF OF 50 OR 60 PEOPLE PROCESSING BUSINESSES LICENSES,
MAYBE, BUT WE HAVE TWO. 
          THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS, IS THAT THEY'RE PROBABLY BUSY ENOUGH WITH THE REAL,
WITH THE WITH THE BIG WITH THE, THE, THE BRICK AND MORTAR BUSINESSES AND THE THOSE THAT WE HAVE. 
          WHAT I DON'T WANT TO DO IS OVERBURDEN OUR STAFF WITH HAVING NOW,
IF SOMEBODY CAN COME UP WITH A WAY TO SAY, I ENTER THIS IN, HIT SUBMIT, IT AUTOMATICALLY APPROVES IT AND KICKS OUT A BUSINESS LICENSE
CERTIFICATE, 
          [00:50:01]
THEN I CAN BUY THAT. BUT IF IT'S GOING TO TAKE STAFF TIME TO PROCESS A LOT OF THESE NON
IMPACT HOME BASED BUSINESSES THEN. THAT'S LIKE THOUSANDS. 
          WELL BUT BUT BUT THEY'RE RUNNING A RESIDENTIAL AREA IS MEANT FOR PEOPLE TO LIVE NOT
NECESSARILY TO HAVE THEIR BUSINESS THERE. 
          SO IT IS AN IMPACT TO THE CITY. AND I AGREE WITH MAYOR BURTON THAT WHEN WE HAVE PEOPLE
CALLING AND SAYING, I REALLY LIKE MY NEIGHBOR. BUT HIS SON MOVED IN AND THEY'RE BRINGING IN ALL THESE OLD
SCHOOL BUSSES AND THEY'RE WELDING AND THEY'RE THIS AND THEY'RE THAT. 
          AND CAN THEY EVEN DO THAT? IT WOULD BE NICE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT AND FOR THE POLICE
DEPARTMENT AND FOR US, QUITE FRANKLY, TO BE ABLE TO SAY, WELL, LET'S SEE IF THEY HAVE A BUSINESS LICENSE TO BE
ABLE TO DO THAT BECAUSE IT IS IMPACTING THE NEIGHBORHOOD. 
          OKAY. I DON'T THINK ANYONE'S GOING TO CALL. SO WHAT IF WHAT IF IT,
INSTEAD OF ALL YOUR LEGAL TERMS MUST SHALL. 
          WHAT IF IT SAID WE ENCOURAGE AND THEN IT'S NOT REQUIRED,
BUT MOST PEOPLE ARE GOING TO DO IT. 
          IF WE ENCOURAGE THEM TO. BUT I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY ARE THERE. 
          I GUESS WHAT THE QUESTION THAT PATRICK'S BEEN DYING TO FIND OUT THE ANSWER TO. 
          SO I'LL GO AHEAD AND ASK. NOUS. AND PAMELA, IF YOU CAN HEAR ME,
PLEASE WEIGH IN AS WELL. 
          DO WE WANT DO WE WANT TO REQUIRE HOME BUSINESSES TO HAVE A LICENSE? IF YOU DO, PLEASE INDICATE. CAN I MAKE ONE MORE? YEAH, I THINK I THINK WHAT WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT IS A LOT OF BOOKKEEPERS,
CPAS, WEBSITE DESIGNERS COMPUTER BASED, MAYBE EVEN ATTORNEYS THAT ARE DOING WORK AT HOME,
THESE SORTS OF THINGS THAT, LIKE, YOU WOULDN'T KNOW THAT THEY'RE THERE. YOU YOU HAVE NO IDEA THAT THE NEIGHBOR DOWN
THE STREET IS DOING BOOKKEEPING SERVICES. 
          UNLESS HE DOES IT FOR YOU ON THE ON THE EVENINGS,
UNLESS HE DOES IT FOR YOU. 
          BUT BUT IT'S IT'S IT'S NO IMPACT. THERE'S NO RESIDENTIAL IMPACT. 
          BECAUSE UNLESS YOU KNEW THAT THAT WAS A BOOKKEEPER BECAUSE YOU'RE GETTING SERVICES
PROVIDED, THERE'S NO IMPACT. MACHINING, WELDING, YOU KNOW,
CONSTANT TRIPS BY PEOPLE TO THE HOME. 
          THESE ARE ALL IMPACT AND IT'S GREATER THAN WHAT WOULD NORMALLY BE THERE. 
          SO SO TO SAY WE WANT WE WANT THE BOOKKEEPER TO GET A LICENSE OR WE ENCOURAGE THEM TO GET A
LICENSE. 
          THEY MAY OR MAY NOT. BUT ENFORCEMENT IS AN ISSUE BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW HOW WE WOULD KNOW
THAT SOMEBODY PRACTICING WEB DESIGN BECAUSE NOBODY KNOWS WEB DESIGN WITHOUT A LICENSE. 
          YEAH. WHY WOULD WE CARE? NOBODY KNOWS IT. IT WOULD BE VERY HARD. 
          IT WOULD BE VERY HARD TO TO KIND OF UNIFORMLY SAY,
THIS IS THIS IS WHAT WE WANT, OTHER THAN YOU KNOW, IF THEY VOLUNTARILY TOLD US, BUT WE WOULDN'T HAVE ANY TEETH BEHIND IT. 
          ANY SUGGESTIONS? I MEAN, MY MY SUGGESTION IS IF IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT AT ENCOURAGING HOME BASED BUSINESS AS AS A MEANS FOR ENTREPRENEURSHIP,
WHICH IS, I THINK, A GOOD IDEA. 
          NOT NOT CHARGING THE APPLICATION FEE IS NICE,
BUT I JUST DON'T KNOW THAT IT'S A BAR TO PEOPLE GETTING INTO THAT, I WOULD CHARGE THE APPLICATION FEE. I WOULD REQUIRE THE BUSINESS LICENSE IF THEY WANT IT
OR IF THEY HAVE AN IMPACT. 
          I JUST THINK IT MAKES SOME CLEAN LINES. HOW DO HOW DO WE HOW DO WE DISTINGUISH THE IMPACT. 
          IT'S SO THAT'S WHAT WE'VE THAT'S A LOT OF AND I DON'T HAVE TO BECAUSE THAT THIS CAN SAY
THAT AND YOU HAVE TO FIGURE IT OUT. 
          THE CODE THE CODE THE CODE DICTATES WHAT WHAT HOW HOW WE DESIGNATE WHAT IS IMPACT AND WHAT
IS NOT. 
          A LOT OF IT HAS TO DO WITH TITLE 13 AND WHAT'S CONTAINED IN OUR ZONING REGULATIONS FOR AN
IMPACT PROPERTY. 
          I DON'T KNOW IF SCOTT WANTS TO TALK TO IT AT ALL. 
          BUT IT'S PRETTY REPLETE. IT IS. IT IS VERY THOROUGH,
SUCH THAT WE REMOVED A LOT OF THE DUPLICATES AND EVEN CONTRADICTORY LANGUAGE FROM TITLE FOUR TO HELP SIMPLIFY THAT, BECAUSE OFTENTIMES A LOT OF OUR HOME OCCUPATION PEOPLE,
THEY, THEY ARE MAYBE STARTING A BUSINESS. THEY'RE NEW TO THE,
THE, THE FIELD THAT THEY'RE GOING INTO. 
          I DON'T KNOW THAT THEY WANT TO SPEND HOURS JUMPING THROUGH DIFFERENT SECTIONS OF OUR CODE. 
          IF WE CAN SAY YOU NEED A LICENSE PURSUANT TO TITLE FOUR,
CHAPTER TWO, AND YOUR REGULATIONS ARE CONTAINED IN TITLE 13, 
          [00:55:06]
I THINK THAT THAT KIND OF SIMPLIFIES AND HELPS THEM NAVIGATE THAT PROCESS AS WELL. 
          MAYOR MAYBE I CAN HELP DIFFERENTIATE A LITTLE BIT. 
          YOU MENTIONED CPAS OR ATTORNEYS. MY CPA HAS A BUSINESS IN HIS HOME. 
          I GO THERE, I MAKE A COUPLE OF VISITS, DROP DOCUMENTS OFF. 
          HE HAS AN EMPLOYEE THAT WORKS AND PARKS THEIR CAR IN HIS DRIVEWAY OR IN THE STREET. 
          BUT I HAVE A RELATIVE WHO WORKS FOR AN AIRLINE WHO WORKS OUT OF HER HOME. 
          BUT MY MIND, I WOULDN'T SAY THAT WOULD BE A HOME BUSINESS BECAUSE THAT IS THE AIRLINE'S
BUSINESS. 
          AND SHE'S DOING THAT THERE. NO ONE EVER COMES AND VISITS. 
          I WOULD THINK THAT WOULD NOT BE ONE THAT WOULD BE ON THERE. 
          YOU MENTIONED MAYBE ONE THAT DOES LIKE MEDICAL BILLING. 
          THEY DON'T GET VISITS. THEY DON'T GET ANYTHING. THEY'RE WORKING FOR A DIFFERENT COMPANY
FROM THERE. WHEN WE HAD THE PANDEMIC, I SENT EMPLOYEES HOME TO WORK. THEY EACH OF THOSE PLACES,
I DIDN'T EVEN THINK ABOUT HOME BASED BUSINESSES. 
          HOME BASED BUSINESSES. THAT'S RIGHT. SO I THINK THE HOME BASED BUSINESSES IS DIFFERENT
THAN SOMEONE DOING BILLING THERE. 
          MY CPA WAS HOME BASED BUSINESS. IT HAD AN IMPACT MINOR. 
          IT WAS AN IMPACT. I DROVE THERE FOUR TIMES A YEAR,
BUT HIS EMPLOYEE DROVE THERE. 
          EVERY EXCEEDS THE RESIDENTIAL IMPACT BECAUSE THEY ALSO HAVE FRIENDS COME OVER AND. 
          RIGHT, RIGHT. IT WAS A MINOR IMPACT. THE BIGGER IMPACT WAS I HAD A HOME BASED BUSINESS. 
          I DID HAVE AN EMPLOYEE COME OVER EVERY DAY. I HAD HIM PARKED IN THE DRIVEWAY,
SO IT WAS AN IMPACT. 
          WHEN I FIRST STARTED, I HADN'T. THAT'S PROBABLY NOT MATERIALLY AN IMPACT. 
          I AGREE, AND THE IDEA OF HAVING A LICENSE, IT GOES OVER WHAT THAT MATERIAL IMPACT IS SO
THEY CAN MAKE SURE THEY STAY BELOW THAT LEVEL. 
          IF THEY GET ABOVE THAT LEVEL, THEN THEY'VE GROWN ENOUGH. THEY NEED TO MOVE OUT OF THEIR
HOME INTO A DIFFERENT LOCATION. 
          AND I WAS GETTING TO THAT POINT WITH MY BUSINESS AT ONE TIME,
AND I WAS LOOKING AT OTHER PLACES TO MOVE TO. 
          I FOUND ANOTHER WAY TO DO IT WITHOUT HAVING TO DO THAT,
TO KEEP THAT IMPACT DOWN. 
          BUT AND THE OTHER GOOD THING ABOUT GETTING A LICENSE IS YOU GET THAT LIST AND YOU SIGN
SAYING, I WILL MEET ALL THOSE LIST OF REQUIREMENTS AND I WILL MAKE SURE I'M UNDER THAT. 
          AND IF YOU GET ABOVE THAT, THEN WE'D HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO TELL THEM IT'S TIME FOR THEM
TO MOVE TO ANOTHER LOCATION. SEE, I KIND OF AGREE WITH THE MAYOR. IS THAT. AND I'M GOING TO AND I'M GOING TO GIVE YOU A
PERFECT EXAMPLE. 
          IF I'M IF I'M A SOLO PRACTITIONER, AS AN ATTORNEY,
I HAVE TO HAVE A BUSINESS LICENSE. 
          BUT IF I WORK FOR MY SON WHO'S GOT AN OFFICE IN DRAPER AND I TELL THE WORK OF MY HOUSE,
I DON'T HAVE TO HAVE A BUSINESS LICENSE. 
          AND WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE? THE IMPACT IS EXACTLY THE SAME. 
          I'M SITTING AT A COMPUTER AND I'M TYPING UP SOMETHING,
OR I'M DOING RESEARCH. 
          AND SO WE'VE GOT WE'VE ALSO GOT TO LOOK AT AT THINGS ABOUT WHAT GOVERNMENT CAN'T REGULATE
EVERYTHING. 
          AND, AND WHAT DO WE WANT TO REGULATE AND WHAT'S AN APPROPRIATE MEANS TO REGULATE. 
          AND I GOTTA TELL YOU IF IT'S A NON IMPACT WE JUST AND UNLESS THEY NEED A LICENSE FOR,
FOR THEIR TO PROVE TO SOMEBODY THAT THEY'RE A BUSINESS, I DON'T EVEN THINK THEY NEED ONE. 
          WELL, SO I GUESS THE QUESTION IS, ARE WE COMFORTABLE WITH WHAT MR. BOYCE HAS WHICH SAYS HOME OCCUPATION SHALL OBTAIN AND MAINTAIN A GENERAL BUSINESS LICENSE
FROM THE CITY OF WEST JORDAN. IF AND IT'S THE ONE THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT,
IS THE SECOND ONE THAT SAYS IT IS DETERMINED THAT THE BUSINESS WILL HAVE A COMBINED OFF SITE IMPACT THAT MATERIALLY EXCEEDS THE OFF SITE IMPACT OF THE PRIMARY
RESIDENTIAL USE ALONE. 
          THAT'S DIRECTLY FROM STATE CODE. ARE WE COMFORTABLE WITH THAT? I GUESS WE NEED TO BE. IF IT'S DIRECTLY FROM STATE CODE IS ABOUT CHARGING A FEE FOR THAT. 
          BUT YEAH, THAT'S THE EXACT SAME LANGUAGE THE STATE CODE USES TO DETERMINE IF YOU CAN OR
NOT. 
          SO ARE WE COMFORTABLE GOING WITH WHAT MR. BOYCE HAS THERE? IS THAT SUFFICIENT? I KNOW COUNCIL MEMBER BLOOM. 
          I IT IS. I'M FINE WITH IT. I'M FINE WITH HOW IT IS. 
          I DON'T WE DON'T NEED TO MANDATE ANYTHING. WELL,
WE ARE MANDATING BY WHAT IT SAYS, RIGHT? WHAT I JUST. NO NO NO NO NO WE DON'T. I YEAH I MEAN,
WE DON'T NEED TO MANDATE THE LITTLE GUYS LIKE SOMEONE WEB DESIGNER. 
          THAT'S WHY I'M AGAINST. OKAY, OKAY. ALL RIGHT,
MR. BOYCE, I'M OKAY WITH AN APPLICATION FEE. I WOULD LIKE IT TO BE SMALLER,
MAYBE $25 OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          BUT JUST FOR THE. WHERE DID WE COME UP WITH THE $55 AMOUNT IN THE. 
          DO YOU KNOW, DO YOU KNOW WHERE THE AMOUNT CAME FROM? IS IT JUST OUR STANDARD APPLICATION FEE THAT WE CHARGE EVERYBODY,
ANYBODY THAT ANYBODY THAT SUBMITS A COMPLETED APPLICATION GETS CHARGED THE SAME AMOUNT 
          [01:00:09]
FOR, FOR THE PROCESSING OF, OF THAT APPLICATION STRAIGHT 50 PRCHAL. 
          OR WE SHOULD JUST LEAVE THAT ALONE AT HOME. IT'S BEEN THAT WAY FOR A LONG TIME. 
          I WOULDN'T WANT TO TOUCH IT. WELL, I'D LIKE TO,
BECAUSE SOMETHING'S BEEN THAT WAY. 
          HOLD ON, HOLD ON. IN THIS ROOM. I'VE SEEN THIS ROOM MANY TIMES. 
          AND WE TALK ABOUT ROI AND COSTS AND MAKING PEOPLE PAID FOR ELECTIONS. 
          AND NOW WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT CUTTING BACK. LET'S JUST LEAVE IT LIKE IT IS. 
          IF IT HASN'T BEEN, NO ONE HAS CALLED AND SAID,
THAT'S TOO HIGH. 
          EVERYONE'S BEEN PAYING IT. SO WHY? WHY GO FOR A LOWER PAYMENT? AND THEY ARE HAVING AN IMPACT ON OUR ON OUR CITY. 
          AND MANY OF THE TIMES THAT IS CODE ENFORCEMENT AND POLICE. 
          AND I CAN I CAN TELL YOU BECAUSE I VISIT THEM ALMOST EVERY DAY. 
          BUT THE BUSINESS LICENSE PROCESS FOLKS ARE HOPPING ALL DAY. 
          BOTH JIM AND EILEEN ARE GOING ALL DAY, EVERY DAY. 
          THEY'RE FIELDING CALLS. THEY'VE GOT APPLICATIONS COMING IN. 
          THEY'RE DEFINITELY NOT UNDER WORK. I DON'T KNOW. 
          SO IT SOUNDS LIKE COUNCIL MEMBER GREENE HAD A GREAT IDEA,
ESPECIALLY FOR THESE HOME BUSINESSES THAT MAY BE ABLE TO APPLY ONLINE AND JUST GET IT. DID YOU KNOW YOU CAN DO THAT FOR AN EIN? SO YEAH, I DID. I DID KNOW THAT IT'S FANTASTIC. 
          YEAH. AND THE IRS OF ALL PEOPLE MAKING IT EASY FOR US. 
          WE CAN LOOK WE CAN TALK TO TO IT AND AND LOOK AT CITYWORKS AND AND SEE WHAT WE CAN GET. 
          AND AND JUST SEE WHAT THAT REQUIRES. THE ISSUE THAT IT'S GOING TO REQUIRE,
THOUGH, IS WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO LOOK AT WHETHER IT'S AN IMPACT. 
          AND THEY'RE SAYING IT'S NOT AN IMPACT. BUT I MEAN,
IT'S SOMETHING THAT, THAT WE COULD LOOK AT. 
          IT MAY NOT BE IN A MINUTE, BUT YEAH, I MEAN AFTER IT'S REVIEWED. 
          SO THAT'S ALREADY WHAT WE DO. AND AND WE DO SEND IT OUT ELECTRONICALLY. 
          EVERYBODY GETS THEIR BUSINESS LICENSE IN A PDF FORMAT EMAILED TO THEM. 
          SO IT'S PRETTY SLICK. IT JUST REQUIRES THAT PAYMENT AND A LITTLE BIT OF PROCESS,
BUT WELL, IT. CHAD'S COMFORTABLE WITH THE APPLICATION FEE. 
          I'M COMFORTABLE WITH THE APPLICATION FEE. DO I HAVE TWO MORE THAT ARE COMFORTABLE WITH THE
APPLICATION FEE AS IT IS. 
          TO BE CONSTRUED AS A AS A LICENSE FEE? THAT'S THAT'S A COUNCIL MEMBER. 
          JACOB HAD A QUESTION ABOUT THAT. YEAH. I LOOKED AT THE CODE AND THEY'RE RIGHT. THE STATE
CODE SAYS THE APPLICATION FEE IS SEPARATE FROM BUSINESS LICENSE AND IT'S SPECIFICALLY AUTHORIZED. HOWEVER, OUR CONSOLIDATED FEE SCHEDULE UNDER BUSINESS LICENSE HAS HOME
OCCUPATION WHEN REQUIRED, APPLICATION FEE AND A FEE. YEAH. IF I WERE TO TELL YOU THAT WE'RE HAVING SOME INTERNAL
DISCUSSIONS ON HOW WE PHRASE CERTAIN THINGS SURROUNDING HOME OCCUPATIONS, THAT WOULD BE AN ACCURATE STATEMENT. 
          WE'RE WORKING ON, AND WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW IS WHAT THE REVENUE RECEIVED IS FROM HOME
OCCUPATION LICENSES, FROM THE APPLICATION AND FROM THOSE THAT PAY THE FEE AND KNOW WHAT THAT TOTAL IS. 
          SO IF WE KNOW THAT IF WE TWEAK ONE NUMBER, WHAT WE'VE GOT TO MAKE UP FOR IT ON WITH THE
OTHER NUMBER, RIGHT? IF WE'RE BRINGING IN $1,000 AND WE'RE SAYING WE'RE GOING TO CUT FEE NUMBER ONE IN
HALF, THEN WE KNOW WE NEED TO RAISE FEE NUMBER TWO AND DOUBLE IF THEY'RE 5050,
RIGHT, OR WHATEVER. 
          WHATEVER THAT FORMULA IS THAT WE CAN WE CAN PROBABLY PULL THOSE THOSE NUMBERS. 
          CAN I ASK A QUESTION? YEAH. IF A HOME BASED BUSINESS APPLIES FOR A LICENSE,
A BUSINESS LICENSE, DO THEY HAVE TO REAPPLY EVERY SINGLE YEAR? JUST HAVE TO RENEW. IT'S AN ONLINE RENEWAL AND THERE'S NO FEE ATTACHED TO IT. 
          SO IT SHOULD BE AS SIMPLE AS GOING INTO THE SYSTEM AND JUST RENEWING. 
          SO I SAY FOR MY BUSINESS IT'S NON-IMPACT. I APPLY ONCE,
PAY THE $55, AND THEN NEXT YEAR AND THE YEAR AFTER THAT, THERE'S NO FEE. NO FEE. YEAH, I THINK THAT'S REASONABLE. 
          I AGREE, I THINK THAT'S VERY REASONABLE. OKAY. 
          SO OKAY, SO I'M NOT GOING TO LOSE SLEEP OVER ANY OF THIS. 
          OKAY. SO ALAN, IT SOUNDS LIKE COUNCIL MEMBER SHELTON,
COUNCIL MEMBER LAM, COUNCIL MEMBER WHITELOCK, COUNCIL MEMBER BADER COUNCIL MEMBER BLOOM ARE OKAY AND COUNCIL MEMBER JACOBS. 
          EITHER WAY, HE'S NOT GOING TO LOSE SLEEP. YEAH,
HE WON'T LOSE ANY SLEEP UNLESS HE DOESN'T HAVE. 
          IF HE'S ONLY GOT 50 WHEN HE NEEDS HIS APPLICATION FEE,
THEN HE MIGHT LOSE SLEEP. 
          [01:05:01]
I MIGHT HAVE PAID THE 50, BUT I DON'T REMEMBER FOUR YEARS AGO. 
          SO IF THE COUNCIL'S OKAY, I'LL JUST BRING THIS BACK TO A BUSINESS MEETING. 
          WE'LL GET THOSE NUMBERS FOR YOU ON ON THE APPLICATION FEES THAT WE COLLECT AND AS PART OF
THE HOME OCCUPATION. 
          EVEN THOUGH I'M NOT ON THE RCA. ALAN, DO I HAVE TO? YES. COUNCIL OFFICE DIRECTOR WOULD LIKE YOUR ASSISTANCE ON THE NEXT ONE,
WHICH YOU ARE INVOLVED IN DISCUSSION ON PROPOSED AMENDMENTS TO TITLE TWO AND TITLE THREE RELATED TO FEE
WAIVERS. 
          [c.
 Discussion on Proposed Amendments to West Jordan City Code Title 2 and 3 Related to Fee Waivers]
MR. ANDERSON. THANK YOU, MR. BOYCE. JUST OVER,
OVER THE LAST SEVERAL YEARS, THERE'S BEEN THERE HAVE BEEN QUESTIONS ON FEE WAIVERS FROM INDIVIDUALS THAT REQUEST IT. REQUEST FEE WAIVERS. 
          THERE'S ALSO BEEN NEIGHBORHOOD WATCH ORGANIZATIONS. 
          THERE'S BEEN BASEBALL, FOOTBALL LEAGUES. AND WE JUST NEED TO GET SOME ADDITIONAL CLARITY. 
          SO COUNCIL MEMBER GREEN HAD DRAFTED SOME CODE AMENDMENTS BACK IN LATE MARCH. 
          AND BY THE TIME THE ATTORNEYS AND I HAD LOOKED OVER,
WE GOT INTO BUDGET SEASON. 
          SO NOW WE'RE BRINGING IT BACK. PATRICK HAS LOOKED IT OVER. 
          AND SO TITLE TWO, THE CHANGES TO TITLE TWO, WHICH IS SIMPLY ADDING A $5,000 PROVISION. 
          SO IF YOU GO TO THE TITLE TWO SECTION FIRST IN TWO,
SIX, THREE, THERE'S A LINE THAT'S ADDED. 
          ONE OF THE ISSUES IS WHEN WHEN PEOPLE ARE APPLYING FOR FEE WAIVERS,
EVEN IF IT'S AN INDIVIDUAL YOU KNOW, MISS MRS. DOE, YOUR BUSINESS NAME APPLIES FOR A FEE WAIVER. 
          AND JUST AS AN INDIVIDUAL, THIS SAYS THAT WE WANT TO LOOK AT YOUR BOOKS. 
          WE WANT TO LOOK AT YOUR ACCOUNTING SYSTEMS. WE I DON'T KNOW THAT WE WOULD DO THAT FOR AN
INDIVIDUAL. 
          THAT'S THAT'S WHAT'S IN TWO, SIX, THREE. 63. JUST CALL IT UP THERE REAL QUICK. 
          SO WHAT THIS WOULD BE IS BASICALLY AN ORGANIZATION THAT RECEIVES A FEE WAIVER IN EXCESS OF
$5,000 WOULD BE SUBJECT TO SOME OF THE AUDITING INTEREST OF THE COUNCIL, WHICH IS ALLOWED. BUT IT'S JUST ADDING THAT ONE LINE IN 263. 
          SO ALL INDIVIDUALS AND ENTITIES RECEIVING 5000 OR MORE IN CITY SUPPORT SHALL AGREE TO THE
FOLLOWING REQUIREMENTS. 
          THEY CAN PERMIT THE CITY OR AN AUDITOR TO INSPECT THE SYSTEMS OF ACCOUNT ACCOUNTING
SYSTEMS, PROTOCOLS. PROVIDE YEARLY FINANCIAL REPORTS IN A FORM ACCEPTED THESE. 
          THIS REALLY APPLIES TO THINGS LIKE THE MUSEUM. 
          AND THE WAS THE WELL IS THE ARTS AND THE CHAMBER,
THOSE TYPE OF THINGS. 
          SO THAT'S THE CHANGES IN TITLE TWO AND THEN THE CHANGES IN TITLE THREE. 
          JUST CLEAR UP SOME CONFUSION IN THERE. SO THE OLD CODE TALKED ABOUT IN DEFINITIONS. 
          AND PATRICK YOU CAN ADD ON IT TALKS ABOUT PENALTIES ON SERVICE FEES,
FORFEITURE GOODS AND SERVICES. 
          WHAT WE'RE BASICALLY DOING IS IN THE CODE, IT ALLOWS THE MAYOR TO FORGIVE PENALTIES,
INTEREST OR FINES, BUT NOT FEES BECAUSE THAT'S RESERVED TO THE COUNCIL. 
          AND THEN AUTHORIZATION TO REMIT. SO THIS IS WHERE THE MAYOR IS IN B THE MAYOR'S AUTHORITY. 
          THE MAYOR MAY REMIT PENALTIES OR FINES, SETTLE MONETARY OBLIGATIONS AS OR OWED TO THE CITY
AS ESTABLISHED IN THOSE 322 AND 989989 IS THE STORM SEWER REIMBURSEMENT PROGRAM,
FOR INSTANCE, RECTIFY AN ALLEGED ERROR AND THEN THE COUNCIL HAS THE AUTHORITY TO WAIVE FEES. THE MAYOR CAN'T WAIVE FEES. 
          THE COUNCIL WAIVES FEES. THIS GETS US A LITTLE CLOSER TO TO 1082. 
          AND I DON'T KNOW IF COUNCIL MEMBER GREEN HE'S THE ONE THAT ORIGINALLY DRAFTED THIS. 
          IF HE HAD SOME INPUT THAT WAS THAT WAS LIKE 12 MONTHS AGO. 
          IT WAS MARCH. YEAH. WELL IT WAS ABOUT 12 MONTHS AGO. 
          I HAVE A QUESTION ON THE 5000. WHERE DID WE COME UP WITH THE 5000? THAT'S A NUMBER THAT THAT PATRICK AND I CAME UP WITH FOR JUST A STARTING POINT. 
          IN MY MIND, 4700 IS WHAT WE GIVE TO THE MUSEUM,
AM I? NO, I THINK IT'S 57. IS IT 57? SO IT'S OVER 57. 
          OKAY. OKAY. MUSEUMS ON A FEE WAIVER. JUST SUPPORT. 
          I THINK THAT'S WHAT THE TITLE. TITLE TWO CONTEMPLATES SUPPORT,
BOTH MONETARY AND NON-MONETARY. 
          SO. SO THAT'S THAT'S WHERE TITLE TWO IS, IS COMING IN TO SAY IF IF THERE'S CITY SUPPORT
THAT'S GIVEN. 
          [01:10:07]
AND I THINK THE DISCUSSION THAT WAS HAD IS JUST THAT IF IT'S OF A SUBSTANTIAL NATURE THAT
THAT THAT WOULD, YOU KNOW, BE SOMETHING THAT THE COUNCIL WOULD WANT TO BE INVOLVED IN. BUT SO I'M LOOKING
AT THIS, WHICH ONE ARE YOU ON? I'M, I'M, I'M LOOKING AT THE THREE FOR THREE FEE WAIVERS. 
          AND IT. IT'S IN RED BUT IT SHOULD BE IN I'M NOT SURE WHY IT'S IN FORMATTING GOT OFF ON
THAT ONE. 
          SOME OF THE BLUES CROSSED OUT. THIS ONE DOES NOT APPLY. I KNOW,
YEAH. 
          THE AP STANDARD IS CALLED THE AP. SO THIS THIS IS FEE WAIVER REQUIREMENTS. 
          AND IT SAYS FOR NONPROFIT ENTITIES. I THINK ALAN,
AND THE ONE THAT I GAVE YOU GUYS DRAFTS OF, WE DEFINED WHAT NONPROFIT PROPHET WAS I'M I'M I'M EXTREMELY UNCOMFORTABLE HERE WITH
PROVIDING PROOF OF CURRENT REGISTRATION AS A NONPROFIT ENTITY. THE WHERE THAT CAME FROM. 
          AND AS PATRICK AND I REVIEWED IT STATE LAW 1082 ONLY REFERENCES NONPROFIT ENTITIES IN. 
          YEAH. AND AND I THINK WE CAN DEFINE NONPROFIT ENTITY. 
          HERE'S MY PROBLEM WITH THIS. IF, IF, IF WE'RE IF WE'RE LIMITING NONPROFIT ENTITY TO
501350134501, WHATEVER. SEE SOMETHING? WE CAN'T WAIVE A FEE FOR A NEIGHBORHOOD GROUP. 
          THE DEFINITION NEEDS TO BE THAT A NONPROFIT GROUP IS EITHER NONPROFIT AS DEFINED BY THE
IRS OR RECOGNIZED BY THE CITY IN SOME WAY, SHAPE OR FORM,
WHETHER IT'S A NEIGHBORHOOD WATCH OR A NEIGHBORHOOD COUNCIL OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. YEAH. THIS IS THIS IS WOEFULLY INCOMPLETE. 
          YOU'RE RIGHT. BECAUSE IT'S JUST AS THE REQUIREMENTS ARE SET FORTH AS FOLLOWS. 
          FOR NONPROFITS, THESE ARE THE REQUIREMENTS. IT DOESN'T SAY REQUIREMENTS ARE WELL,
WE CAN ONLY WE CAN REALLY ONLY WE CAN PROVIDE MONETARY ASSISTANCE TO ANY UNDER 22. WE CAN PROVIDE MONETARY ASSISTANCE TO ANYBODY WE WANT. 
          BUT THE MONETARY ASSISTANCE TO ANYBODY BESIDES NONPROFIT REQUIRES THE QUID PRO QUO STUDY,
UNLESS IT'S UNLESS IT'S ALREADY BUDGETED FOR AND SET ASIDE. 
          BUT THAT'S RIGHT. BUT THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS,
IS THAT WE DON'T BUDGET FOR FEE WAIVERS FOR DUMPSTERS. 
          AND THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS, IS THAT IF WE'RE TRYING TO ENCOURAGE THE BROWNS PARK
NEIGHBORHOOD FOR A DUMPSTER OR THE WINFIELD HEIGHTS NEIGHBORHOOD WATCH TO DO DUMPSTERS,
WE NEED TO DEFINE THERE CLEARLY A NON FOR PROFIT GROUP AND WHAT WE'RE DOING RIGHT NOW IS WE'RE PLAYING. I'M GOING TO TELL YOU,
WE'RE PLAYING A GOOFY GAME WITH THE WITH THE THE DUMPSTER WITH THE DUMPSTER WAIVERS, BECAUSE WHAT WE'RE DOING IS THE PEOPLE ARE COMING IN AND SAYING,
I'M GOING TO GIVE UP MY DUMPSTER WAIVER OR MY $75 DUMPSTER, AND THERE'S TEN OF US IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD. WE'LL GIVE THAT UP. IF YOU'LL WAIVE THE FEE FOR
THE NEIGHBORHOOD, THE NEIGHBORHOOD GROUP SHOULD BE ABLE TO COME IN AS A NEIGHBORHOOD GROUP OF SOME SORT OF
RECOGNIZED GROUP, WHETHER IT'S THE NEIGHBORHOOD WATCH OR NEIGHBORHOOD COUNCIL. 
          IF WE EVER ESTABLISH THOSE, THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO COME IN AND SAY,
OUR NEIGHBORHOOD GROUP WANTS TO ESTABLISH, WANTS TO HAVE SOME DUMPSTERS, AND WE SHOULD BE ENCOURAGING IN THAT. 
          BUT THIS DOESN'T ALLOW US TO DO IT BECAUSE WE'D SAY,
WELL, YOU GOTTA GO ESTABLISH YOURSELF AS A 500 1C3 AND GO THROUGH ALL THAT NONSENSE. 
          SO THAT AND THE THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS, NO,
WE WANT THEM TO HAVE THE DUMPSTERS. 
          SO IS THERE ANOTHER WAY TO ACCOMPLISH THAT? NO,
WE COULD JUST. 
          COULD WE IN OUR BUDGET. COULD WE IN OUR BUDGET JUST HAVE AN AMOUNT PUT IN THERE FOR
NEIGHBORHOOD DUMPSTERS? I THINK WE ADD ON TO THAT REAL QUICK. SO ONE OF ONE OF THE ISSUES AS,
AS THIS HAS CREPT UP, WHICH IS WHY I THINK IT'S REALLY GOOD THAT WE'RE DISCUSSING THIS AND I'M NOT ASKING FOR AN
APPROVAL. I'M ASKING FOR GETTING YOUR INPUT AND COMING BACK TO A WORK SESSION WHEN MISS SANDLIN COMES IN AND REQUESTS TEN DUMPSTERS AS A FEE WAIVER. 
          SO IT'S ALREADY SUBSIDIZED, RIGHT? AND YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO PAY $75 IN THE SUBSIDY,
I THINK IS ABOUT ANOTHER 250 ISH PER DUMPSTER, PER DUMPSTER THAT YOU'RE WAIVING MONEY OUT OF THE SOLID WASTE FUND,
WHICH IS WHAT PAYS FOR THAT. 
          SO KIND OF WHAT COUNCILMAN CHAIR WHITELOCK IS TALKING ABOUT IS IF THE COUNCIL WERE TO FUND
WHETHER IT'S COMMUNITY ESTHETICS, WHICH IS ONE OF THE GOALS FOR THE GOALS OF THE CITY COUNCIL AND AS A COMMUNITY ESTHETICS
LINE ITEM IN THE BUDGET. 
          YOU CAN CONTROL THAT. SAY IT'S 5000, 10,000. YOU CAN PUT IT IN BRIAN'S BUDGET AND HE CAN
MANAGE IT. 
          [01:15:03]
OR, YOU KNOW, WHOEVER MAYOR'S BUDGET, THE COUNCIL OFFICE BUDGET MAYBE. 
          AND YOU ALLOCATE THAT SO THAT WHEN MISS ANDERSON COMES IN AND GETS HER FEE WAIVER,
THERE'S A TRANSFER OF FUNDS SO THAT THE SOLID WASTE FUND, WHICH IS A RESTRICTED ACCOUNT, REMAINS WHOLE. 
          THAT'S ONE WAY WHERE YOU CAN SOLVE NOT ALL, BUT SOME. 
          THAT DOESN'T SOLVE THE PROBLEM BECAUSE WHAT YOU DO IS BUT WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU RUN OUT OF
MONEY. 
          AND THEN THEY COME IN AND APPLY AN APPLICATION AND YOU'VE ALREADY EXCEEDED THE BUDGET. 
          WELL, YOU'VE WAITED SINCE MARCH. WE'LL LET THEM WAIT FOR ONE MORE SEASON OR OR YOU DO A
BUDGET AMOUNT. 
          I MEAN, WHAT I'M SAYING IS THERE'S MORE THAN ONE WAY THAN JUST DOING A FEE WAIVER. 
          ANOTHER ANOTHER ONE THAT I THINK THE COUNCIL NEEDS TO TALK ABOUT IS ORIGINALLY WHEN WE
PROPOSED THE FEE FEE WAIVER PROCESS SEVERAL YEARS AGO. 
          I THINK ROB WALL WAS STILL HERE. THE COUNCIL AT THE TIME DIRECTED THAT ALL FEE WAIVERS GO
GO THROUGH THE COUNCIL. 
          JUST A COUPLE MEETINGS AGO, YOU HAD A FEE WAIVER FOR $77 WHERE THE COST OF STAFF TO PUT IT
ON A PACKET, WRITE UP THE REPORTS, GATHER THE INFORMATION,
PUBLISH THE PUBLIC HEARING NOTICE WE EXCEEDED WHAT YOU WAIVED IN FEE. 
          BUT THE LAW DOESN'T RECOGNIZE GOVERNMENT. GOVERNMENT DOESN'T. 
          DOESN'T. GOVERNMENT IS NOT NECESSARILY EFFICIENT WHEN IT'S TRANSPARENT. 
          I'M NOT DISAGREEING WITH THAT. WHAT I WHAT I'M SAYING IS ONE WAY TO WORK THROUGH THE FEE
WAIVER PROCESS, BECAUSE IT HAS TO BE EITHER BUDGETED BY THE COUNCIL OR WAIVED BY THE COUNCIL IS AGAIN,
THIS THIS MONEY THAT'S BUDGETED BY THE COUNCIL, APPROVED AND ADOPTED, COULD BE USED FOR AN AMOUNT LESS THAN $200,
LESS THAN $100 LESS THAN $500, AND IT CAN BE PROCESSED EITHER ADMINISTRATIVELY WITH A REPORT GIVEN TO THE COUNCIL. 
          MY. AS THE COUNCIL DIRECTOR, MY MY ONE CONCERN I'VE TALKED TO DENISE ABOUT THIS IS WE'RE
WORKING ON THIS PACKET IS WHEN WE'RE STARTING TO TALK ABOUT RESTRICTED ACCOUNTS AND WAIVING FEES ON THE SOLID WASTE. 
          THAT BURDEN GETS SHIFTED ELSEWHERE DEPENDING ON HOW MANY PEOPLE WAIVE THE DUMPSTER FEES. 
          SO I THINK YOU CAN HAVE TWO, THREE, FOUR PATHS TO ADDRESS EXACTLY WHAT YOU'RE TALKING
ABOUT. 
          COUNCIL MEMBER GREEN WITH INDIVIDUALS, NONPROFITS MUSEUMS,
ART. 
          SO I HERE'S WHERE I'M GOING TO WHERE I'M GOING TO TAKE ISSUE WITH WHAT YOU JUST SAID. 
          OKAY. THE GOAL OF 1082 AND THE AND THE COUNCIL WAIVING FEES IS FOR TRANSPARENCY. IF WE START TO SAY, YOU KNOW WHAT,
TRANSPARENCY IS TOO DIFFICULT. 
          LET'S JUST GET LET'S JUST CREATE A SLUSH FUND AND SOMEBODY CAN COME IN AND ASK FOR THE
WAIVER. 
          AND ANYBODY CAN JUST SAY, LET'S GIVE IT TO HIM WITHOUT ANY COUNCIL OVERSIGHT WITH A REPORT
TO THE COUNCIL. 
          YEAH, THE REPORTS AFTER THE FACT AND YOU CAN'T DO ANYTHING AND YADA,
YADA YADA. 
          THERE IS NO GOVERNMENT TRANSPARENCY AND THERE IS NO ACCOUNTABILITY. 
          AND 1082 IS DESIGNED FOR ACCOUNTABILITY, NOT EFFICIENCY. 
          AND SO YES, IT MAY COST US MORE MONEY IN STAFF TIME,
BUT THAT'S THE BY NECESSITY, THE GOVERNMENT TRANSPARENCY IN 1082. AND I TO ME GOVERNMENT TRANSPARENCY. AND YOU KNOW,
DO I THINK THAT IT WAS KIND OF SILLY. TO PAY THE THE THE FOR US TO HAVE TO DEAL WITH THE $77 FEE WAIVER. YEAH, BUT THAT'S US BEING TRANSPARENT AND KNOWING WHAT'S GOING ON IN THE CITY AND PEOPLE SAYING, HEY,
I WANT, I NEED SOME, I NEED SOME FREE SERVICES FROM THE CITY AND HERE'S WHY. 
          AND AND THE $77 THAT WAS FOR THE THE SUICIDE AWARENESS CLASSES DOWN IN THE COMMUNITY,
IF I REMEMBER RIGHT. 
          THAT'S AN EASY THAT'S A NO BRAINER. BUT THAT ALSO GETS THE COUNCIL INVOLVED IN KNOWING
WHAT'S GOING ON IN THE COMMUNITY AND THOSE KIND OF THINGS TO SAY, HEY, BUT IF IT'S JUST, HEY, HERE'S A PIECE OF PAPER AND I WANT A $77 FEE WAIVER AND OKAY,
WE GET A QUARTERLY REPORT, WE HAVE NO OVERSIGHT AT THAT POINT. YEAH. WE'VE SAID,
OKAY, SPEND SO MUCH MONEY, YOU CAN YOU CAN SPEND SO MUCH MONEY AND AND BUT I THINK IT DETRACTS FROM THE TRANSPARENCY THAT 1082 IS SUPPOSED,
BECAUSE THAT'S WHY YOU HAVE THE QUID PRO QUO STUDY WHEN YOU GIVE NON-MONETARY ASSISTANCE OR MONETARY OR NON-MONETARY ASSISTANCE TO TO NON TO,
TO THE, TO THE FOR 
          [01:20:06]
PROFITS IS BECAUSE THAT'S BECAUSE NOW YOU'RE TRYING TO LOOK WHAT THE QUID PRO QUO IS AND
WHAT ARE THE BENEFITS FOR THE, THE, YOU KNOW WE'RE GIVING THEM MONEY. 
          WHAT'S THE BENEFIT TO THE CITY FOR IT? DO WE SEE THE VALUE IN THAT FOR THE NON-PROFITS? WE SEE THAT THE NON-PROFITS GETTING MONEY AUTOMATICALLY,
THERE'S SOME SORT OF VALUE. 
          I'M JUST MY MY THOUGHT IS, IS THAT THAT THE THE NONPROFIT HERE DEFINITION IS JUST WAY TOO NARROW. I CAN MAYBE SPEAK TO THAT JUST REAL QUICK TOO. 
          SO A NONPROFIT ENTITY, YOU CAN YOU CAN APPLY THROUGH THE STATE OF UTAH FOR A NONPROFIT
DOMESTIC LLC. 
          IT'S A $30 FILING FEE. AND YOU FAX IT OR MAIL IT IN AND YOU'RE YOU'RE REGISTERED AS A
NONPROFIT. 
          YOU'RE NOT YOU'RE NOT NECESSARILY A CHARITABLE ORGANIZATION TAX EXEMPT UNDER THE IRS. 
          THAT'S NOT WHAT THE CODE REQUIRES. ARE WE SAYING NOW THEN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD GROUPS AND OUR
NEIGHBORHOOD WATCHES THEN HAVE TO GO DOWN AND REGISTER AS A NON FOR PROFIT AND PAY THE $35 SO THAT THEY CAN GET A FEE WAIVER. 
          I WOULD I WOULD SAY THAT IT'S IT'S YOUR DECISION AS TO HOW YOU WANT TO LOOK AT THAT. 
          I THINK THE STATE CODE DOES SAY NONPROFIT ENTITY IN 1082. 
          AND SO MY, MY, MY THOUGHT IS THAT THEY INTENDED IT TO BE AN ENTITY,
NOT JUST A SIMPLE. 
          BUT IF WE SAY THEY'RE A CITY AFFILIATED ENTITY,
NEIGHBORHOOD WATCH. 
          LET'S USE BROWNS MEADOW NEIGHBORHOOD WATCH ENTITY. 
          BUT BUT HOW ARE THEY AFFILIATED WITH THE CITY? THE CITY'S RIGHT. BUT IF THERE'S NO ENTITY TO AFFILIATE WITH,
IF THEY'RE SIMPLE RESIDENTS OF THE CITY. 
          BUT ISN'T EVERYBODY BUT THE CITY? THE CITY HAS ORGANIZED A NEIGHBORHOOD WATCH. 
          THEY'RE FORMALLY RECOGNIZED THAT SOMEHOW, I DON'T KNOW. 
          THAT'S NOT AN ENTITY. SO, PATRICK, HOW WHAT IS IT? IT'S A GROUP OF PEOPLE THAT LIVE IN THE CITY. OKAY,
THEN TO ME, THAT'S AN ENTITY. 
          HOW DO WE HOW DO WE ACCOMPLISH BOTH? THAT'S TOTALLY DIFFERENT. 
          HOW DO WE ACCOMPLISH HAVING SOMETHING FOR NONPROFITS,
BUT ALSO SOMETHING FOR A NEIGHBORHOOD GROUP THAT'S NOT AN ENTITY. 
          THAT ISN'T AN ENTITY. THAT'S AN IDEA. WE'VE GOT THREE FOR THREE HAS AN A,
THERE IS NO B. 
          CAN WE HAVE B BE RECOGNIZED CITY GROUP DON'T HAVE TO PUT ENTITY THE ISSUE. 
          THE ISSUE IS, IS THAT 1082 SPECIFICALLY SAYS THAT WAIVERS ARE FOR NONPROFIT ENTITIES. 
          IT DOESN'T IT DOESN'T PROVIDE FOR WAIVERS FOR INDIVIDUALS OR COMMUNITY GROUPS. 
          I THINK GOING GOING BACK TO THE OTHER THING REAL QUICK TO WHAT KEVIN WAS SAYING,
FIRST OF ALL, IN THE ALMOST TWO YEARS I'VE BEEN HERE, WE'VE NEVER SAID NO TO ANYONE WHO HAS COME TO US
WITH A FEE WAIVER. 
          SO I DON'T REALLY KNOW WHAT GUARDIANS OF THE OF THE PUBLIC INTEREST WE ARE IN THAT. 
          BUT IT'S TRANSPARENT. WELL, BUT I THINK THE OTHER COULD BE TRANSPARENT AS WELL IS IF WHEN
EVERYONE'S DONE, IT'S JUST TOLD TO US THAT WEEKLY OR BIWEEKLY COUNCIL MEETING. 
          THIS IS UP. SO IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE THIS HUGE THING. 
          IT COULD JUST BE AND IT'S TRANSPARENT. IT'S PUT ON RECORD THAT WE WAIVE THIS FEE. 
          IT'S SOMETHING WE'VE DONE EVERY YEAR AND IT DOESN'T NEED TO BE A FULL ACCOUNTING OF IT'S
STILL BEING PUT. 
          STILL TRANSPARENT. IT'S STILL TRANSPARENT. IT'S IN EVERY RECORD. 
          NOTHING BEING HIDDEN. I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANYONE WHO'S GOING THROUGH COUNCIL RECORDS TO
MAKE SURE THAT WE WERE TRANSPARENT ABOUT THE BROWN MEADOWS GROUP AND, AND WHAT WAS GOING ON THERE. AND IF WE START TO GET SOME OF THESE WAIVERS THAT,
THAT ARE LIKE THAT, THAT WOULD BE, I THINK, SOMETHING THAT THE STAFF WOULD THEN BRING TO US. 
          THIS IS NOT A RECOGNIZED ENTITY OR WHAT, BUT IT JUST SEEMS LIKE THE THE IDEA OF THE
TRANSPARENCY IN EVERY LITTLE THING, WE'RE STILL TRANSPARENT. WE DON'T NEED TO BE OVERLY. 
          IS THERE A WAY REDUNDANTLY TRANSMITTED IN THE MIDDLE,
LIKE NOT HAVE STAFF JUST SAY YES OR NO, BUT HAVE IT NOT BE A PUBLIC HEARING, BUT HAVE IT BE A BUSINESS ITEM? THAT AND WE'LL JUST KEEP COOKING ON JENNIFER BECAUSE WE LOVE HER. 
          AND JENNIFER COMES AND SAYS BROWNS MEADOWS WANTS TO DO THEIR NEIGHBOR ANNUAL NEIGHBORHOOD
CLEANUP AND BREAKFAST. 
          THEY'D LOVE TO HAVE THE COUNCIL COME. WILL YOU ALLOCATE FUNDS? AND WE SAY, YES, WE'VE GOT THIS MONEY SET ASIDE AND SO DEDICATED IN BRIAN'S BUDGET FOR THIS THAT THAT WE AS A COUNCIL CAN SAY, YES,
WE WE WE WILL WE WILL LET THAT ONE GO. 
          [01:25:06]
SO THEN WE'RE NOT MAKING THEM HAVE A NONPROFIT,
BUT WE ARE BEING THE GATEKEEPER OF THOSE FUNDS. 
          AND IT IS TRANSPARENT BECAUSE IT IS IN OUR MEETING. 
          BUT IS THAT POSSIBLE? BUT IF THEY'RE A. WELL,
WE'D HAVE TO BUDGET. 
          BUT BUT I THINK YOU HAVE TO BUDGET THE MONEY FOR A SPECIFIC ORGANIZATION TO GET AROUND THE
1082, DON'T YOU. I, I DON'T THINK SO. LET ME, LET ME TURN ATTORNEYS AND ATTORNEYS ARE SMART AND
THEIR JOB IS TO FIGURE IT OUT FOR US. 
          LISTEN. NOT ALL ATTORNEYS ARE SMART. OKAY, WELL YOU ARE. 
          THIS IS TRUE. DON'T ZACH'S POINTING AT ME ON THAT. 
          2261261. SPECIFICALLY, AN ATTACHMENT A READS THAT THE CITY MAY PROVIDE BOTH MONETARY AND
NON-MONETARY ASSISTANCE TO INDIVIDUALS AND ENTITIES FOR THE SAFETY,
HEALTH, PROSPERITY, MORAL WELL-BEING, PEACE, ORDER, COMFORT, AND CONVENIENCE OF CITY RESIDENTS. THAT'S WHAT THIS GROUP SOUNDS
LIKE WITH THE DUMPSTERS AND THE CLEANUP AND THE BREAKFAST. 
          AND WHEN I READ THIS, THAT'S WHAT I THOUGHT WE WERE. 
          THAT WAS THE TO GET AROUND THE NONPROFIT THING. 
          THAT'S WHAT I THOUGHT THAT WAS SPECIFICALLY. AND SO I THINK,
YOU KNOW, AGAIN, THE CITY'S NOT BECOMING AN EMPLOYEE, A REPRESENTATIVE OR AGENT OF, OF THIS INDIVIDUAL OR,
OR ENTITY. 
          THEY NEED TO PRESENT A PROPOSAL. RIGHT? TWO SIX,
TWO. 
          THEY NEED TO GIVE US A PROPOSAL. AND THEN WE'RE SAYING,
HEY, IF IF IT'S MORE THAN A CERTAIN AMOUNT AND FEEL FREE TO SET IT WHATEVER AMOUNT YOU GUYS THINK IS IS BEST. 5000. BUT BUT IF IT'S MORE THAN THAT,
WE JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU GIVE US A FINANCIAL REPORT, MAKE SURE THAT WE KNOW HOW YOU'RE GOING TO BE DOING YOUR AUDITING. 
          MAKE SURE THAT WE KNOW HOW THE ASSISTANCE WILL ADVANCE CITY GOALS. 
          I THINK ALL OF THOSE THINGS START KICKING INTO PLACE,
WHICH IT SOUNDS LIKE THIS GROUP DOES. 
          SO ANYWAY, LET ME ASK YOU THIS QUESTION, BUT FROM A BUDGETED AND SORRY,
FROM A BUDGETED STANDPOINT TO SAY WE'RE SETTING ASIDE THIS, FUNDS FOR THESE PROJECTS, I THINK MAKES SENSE. 
          SO WHAT WOULD HAPPEN? WOULD WOULD IT BE EASIER WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT FEE WAIVERS? INVERSE. WOULD IT BE? BECAUSE THE ONLY THING THAT WE'RE DOING IN TWO SIX IS THAT IF SOMEBODY GETS MORE THAN
$5,000, THEY'LL AGREE TO HOW WE'RE SPENDING IT, RIGHT? IT DOESN'T. MY PROBLEM WITH 261 IS IT DOESN'T TELL US HOW TO DO TO THE TEN EIGHT TWO STUFF
AND THE THE THE THE VERSION OF OF THREE RIGHT NOW DOESN'T WALK THROUGH A LOT OF THE THE STUFF,
BUT I WHEN COUNCIL MEMBER WHITELOCK WAS TALKING HERE WITH MAYBE A COMPROMISE. 
          WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IF THE. FEE WAIVERS. 
          COME OUT OF COUNCIL CONTINGENCY FUNDS. NO, NO,
I'M GOING TO STOP DOING THAT. 
          I'M FINISHED. YEAH. FINISH YOUR THOUGHT. WE WE WE TAKE IT OUT OF COUNCIL CONTINGENCY FUNDS
BECAUSE WE HAVEN'T SPENT THE MAXIMUM. 
          WE HAVEN'T SPENT COUNCIL CONTINGENCY FUNDS IN FOUR YEARS. 
          WE SET THAT AMOUNT AND WE SET THAT AMOUNT. IT COMES OUT OF COUNCIL CONTINGENCY FUNDS. 
          AND SINCE WE'VE ALREADY BUDGETED IT, AND WE CAN INCLUDE THAT AS COUNCIL CONTINGENCY AND
FEE WAIVERS, WE PUT THAT AS THE BUDGET LINE COUNCIL CONTINGENCY AND FEE WAIVERS. 
          IT'S ALREADY BEEN BUDGETED. AND WE JUST PUT IT ON CONSENT ITEM ON AN AGENDA AND APPROVE
IT. 
          WITH THAT WORK, JOSH. I THINK IT WOULD I THINK ONCE THE FUNDS HAVE BEEN APPROPRIATED
THROUGH THE BUDGET PROCESS UNDER THE FISCAL PROCEDURES ACT. 
          I PUT INTO THE CONTINGENCY FUND OR WHATEVER THE COUNCIL FUND IS GOING TO BE CALLED. 
          THEN THE COUNCIL GETS TO DETERMINE HOW THAT GOES OUT. YOU CAN DECIDE WHERE IT GOES. 
          AND HERE'S HERE'S MY THOUGHT ON IT, THOUGH I WOULD AVOID THE USE OF THAT FEE WAIVER. 
          I KNOW. YEAH. WELL BUT YOU KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT. 
          I KNOW, I KNOW, BUT BUT I BUT BUT I WANT TO BE CLEAR. 
          LIKE, IT CAN'T BE A FEE WAIVER BECAUSE WE WANT TO AVOID THAT PUBLIC HEARING. 
          RIGHT. YOU'RE SAYING. WELL, I'M NOT NECESSARILY WORRIED ABOUT THE PUBLIC. 
          NO, I KNOW, BUT BUT BY PUTTING IT ON CONSENT,
THAT'S, THAT'S THE THE ONE OF THE BENEFITS PRESIDENT REQUESTS FOR BETTERMENT OF THE CITY. 
          [01:30:04]
SURE. SOMETHING THAT WE CAN CALL WHATEVER WE WANT TO. 
          BUT I DO AGREE, CALLING IT SOMETHING OTHER THAN FEE WAIVER IN ORDER TO AVOID CROSSING THE
WIRES ON THEIR APPROVAL. 
          AND I CAN BUY THAT. BUT WHAT THE REASON WHY I'M TALKING ABOUT A POOL OF MONEY IS THAT I
DON'T NECESSARILY WANT TO PUT IT IN BRIAN'S BUDGET. 
          YEAH. THE REASON WHY IS JORDAN PARK JORDAN EDUCATION FOUNDATION COMES IN AND ASKS FOR FEE
WAIVERS, FOR THE PARK, FOR ROAD CLOSURES, FOR THOSE KIND OF THINGS WHEN THEY DO THAT BIG EVENT IN
THE SPRING, RIGHT? IF IF WE PUT THAT IN ONE BUDGET NOW WE'VE GOT CROSS BUDGETING STUFF,
AND I THINK IT WOULD BE EASIER IF THE MONEY WERE HELD AT THE COUNCIL WE APPROVE IT AND THEN WE TRANSFER THE WE TRANSFER THAT MONEY TO THE,
THE $77 GOES TO THE BUILDING FUND FOR TO TO COREY. 
          THE THE JORDAN EDUCATION ONES BROKEN DOWN. SOME GOES TO POLICE,
SOME GOES TO FIRE. 
          BUT I WOULDN'T WANT THOSE BIG ONES LIKE THAT. 
          I THINK THEY SHOULD STILL GO THROUGH THE PROCESS. 
          THEY ARE. WELL JORDAN FOUNDATION IS A 501 NONPROFIT AND THEIR THEIR AMOUNT IS FAIRLY HIGH. 
          YEAH. BUT YOU KNOW WHERE I'M GOING WITH THIS IS THAT THE $77 WAS A BUILDING,
ONE WHERE THE LAST JORDAN, THE JORDAN SCHOOL DISTRICT FEE WAIVER WAS FIRST ROAD CLOSURE ON LOOP ROAD. 
          AND SO MY THOUGHT WAS IS IF WE WANTED TO DO THAT COMPROMISE,
THEN THE MONEY'S HELD DESIGNATED AT A AT A AT THE COUNCIL AND THEN IT GETS DIVVIED UP. JUST PAID THE FEE,
WHATEVER THE FEE WOULD GO TO, IT WOULD PAY THAT FEE. 
          SO WOULD WE DO FEE WAIVERS? WE'RE JUST WAVING THEM FOR HAVING TO PAY SOMETHING. 
          IT'S NOT GOING TO HURT THE BANK LIKE IT DOES WITH THE THE GARBAGE CAN. 
          SO WE DON'T WANT TO TAKE COUNCIL CONTINGENCY TO PAY FOR ALL THESE FEE WAIVERS NOW. 
          FEE WAIVERS JUST WE DON'T CHARGE THE CITY. WE DON'T LOSE MONEY. 
          WE JUST DON'T CHARGE THE CITY. BUT WE DO STILL,
BECAUSE THERE'S STILL EXPENSE. 
          YEAH, KINDA DEPENDS ON WHAT IT IS, I THINK. RIGHT. 
          YEAH. LIKE THE GARBAGE, THE DUMPSTERS, THERE'S DUMPSTERS. 
          THERE'S DEFINITELY THERE'S A COST INVOLVED. BUT IF IT'S JUST IF IT'S LIKE SHARING THE ROAD
DOESN'T COST ANYTHING. 
          WELL, IT DOES COST STUFF BECAUSE THE STAFF HAS TO GO OUT AND DO IT. 
          THEY THE OTHER ARGUMENT WOULD BE IF THERE'S NO COST TO IT. 
          THEN WHY ARE WE CHARGING A FEE? SO WE HAVE TO JUSTIFY THE FEE BECAUSE THERE IS SOME COST
THERE DOING IT. 
          AND I THOUGHT THAT COUNCIL MEMBER GREEN WAS GOING TO SAY THAT HE DIDN'T WANT TO PUT IT
INTO BRIAN'S BUDGET, BECAUSE BRIAN WOULD JUST SPEND IT ON CONCRETE. 
          I THOUGHT FOR SURE THAT'S WHERE HE'D SPENT ASPHALT. 
          SOMETHING WOULD BE CONCRETE. ASPHALT, SNOWPLOW BLADES. 
          I JUST DON'T WANT TO TURN THE COUNCIL CONTINGENCY FEE INTO THE WAIVER FEE. 
          WELL, I THINK IT. I DON'T THINK IT SHOULD. I THINK IT SHOULD BE A SEPARATE LINE FROM OUR
CONTINGENCY FEE. 
          I THINK IT SHOULD BE SOMETHING FOR RESIDENTS. 
          COUNCIL PROJECTS OR OR A BETTERMENT FOR THE AN IMPACT FOR BETTERMENT FOR THE CITY
COMMUNITY. 
          BETTERMENT COMMUNITY REQUESTED PROJECTS OR SOMETHING SO THAT IT IS OUTWARD FACING. 
          YEAH, POTENTIALLY BECAUSE ALL THOSE OTHERS. I STILL WANT THEM TO HAVE TO COME TO A PUBLIC
HEARING. 
          I WANT JORDAN EDUCATION FOUNDATION TO SHOW UP IF YOU'RE LISTENING. 
          MIKE, WE JUST LEAVE THINGS THE WAY THEY ARE RIGHT NOW BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT IT SOUNDS LIKE.
SOUNDS LIKE WE JUST WANT TO KEEP IT THE WAY IT IS. 
          WE WANT NO, WE WANT TO MAKE IT A WAY FOR BECAUSE BECAUSE I KEEP HEARING THAT THERE'S NOT
TRANSPARENCY BY DOING THIS. 
          SO WHY ARE WE DOING THIS? WE WANT TRANSPARENCY. NO,
THIS WOULD STILL GIVE US TRANSPARENCY BECAUSE IT WOULD STILL SHOW UP ON AN AGENDA. 
          BUT IF WE JUST THOUGHT THE WAY IT IS TRANSPARENCY TOO. I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHY IT'S
BROKEN AND WHY WE'RE FIXING IT. 
          I MEAN, BECAUSE A $77 FEE REQUEST AND FOR JENNIFER AND THEN BRIAN'S BUDGET IS SHORT
BECAUSE WE'RE WAIVING IT. 
          AGAIN TO AND THAT'S A SOLID WASTE. SO IT'S A DIFFERENT POT OF MONEY. 
          SO THEN WE JUST NEED A BUDGET AMENDMENT AFTER THAT. 
          MAYBE CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG ON THIS, BUT THE WAY THAT I SEE IT IS THAT OUR CURRENT
PROCESS DOESN'T EXACTLY ALIGN WITH 1082 WHEN WE'RE DEALING WITH INDIVIDUALS AND FOR PROFIT ENTITIES. WE HAVE A PROCESS THAT LARGELY WORKS,
RIGHT? MAYBE THERE'S SOME SITUATIONS THAT WE SEE AS SEEING,
MAYBE REQUIRING MORE PROCESS THAN IS WARRANTED BY THE REQUEST, MAYBE NOT. THAT'S A DETERMINATION THAT YOU GET TO MAKE. 
          BUT IN ANY EVENT, THERE'S, I THINK, AN ARGUMENT TO BE MADE THAT WE'RE NOT IN LINE WITH
1082. 
          AND THAT'S WHAT WE'RE ASKING, IS, WOULD YOU LIKE A PROCESS THAT DOES CONTEMPLATE FOR
PROFIT ENTITIES AND INDIVIDUALS? AND THEN WHAT WOULD WE LIKE THAT TO LOOK LIKE? IT SAYS ONLY NONPROFITS, RIGHT? 1082 ON ITS FACE ONLY CONTEMPLATES FEE WAIVERS FOR
NONPROFITS. 
          IT DOES ALLOW FOR OTHER SITUATIONS WHERE FUNDS CAN BE APPROPRIATED FOR THE BENEFIT OF
INDIVIDUALS, BUT THAT REQUIRES THAT APPROPRIATION PROCESS EITHER THROUGH THE BUDGET OR A BUDGET
AMENDMENT OR SOMETHING. SO IF WE'RE STRICTLY FOLLOWING 1082, 
          [01:35:05]
THE NONPROFIT. CAN BE WAIVED FOR ANY OTHER INDIVIDUAL OR GROUP,
WHETHER THEY'RE AFFILIATED WITH THE CITY OR NOT AT THAT POINT. SO WE'RE TALKING ABOUT JENNIFER'S. 
          WE'LL PICK ON JENNIFER AGAIN THEN THAT TECHNICALLY HAS TO BE THAT'S A THAT'S A
NON-MONETARY ASSISTANCE THAT 1082 SAYS YOU EITHER NEED A QUID PRO QUO STUDY OR IT'S GOT TO BE BUDGETED MONEY. 
          IS THAT IS THAT A FAIR ARGUMENT TO BE MADE THAT THAT'S THE CASE? YES. SO THE THE SIMPLER THING TO DO, BECAUSE WE DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO DO A 1082 STUDY
EVERY TIME WE'RE GOING TO DO A DUMPSTER WAVE. 
          THANK YOU. THEN THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS, IS THAT FOR US TO,
TO, TO BE IN BETTER COMPLIANCE WITH 1082 IS TO ADOPT THIS FOR NONPROFITS AND BUDGET AND CREATE A POLICY THAT SAYS FOR CITY ESTHETICS AND IMPROVEMENTS OR THOSE WHATEVER WE WANT TO CALL THAT CITY OUTWARD FACING,
WHATEVER IT IS, BECAUSE CHAN, I DISAGREE WITH YOU. THE $77 THAT WAS WAIVED FOR THE FOR THAT SUICIDE
AWARENESS TRAINING THAT OCCURRED IN THE COMMUNITY. IT COST US MONEY. BUT THAT'S BECAUSE THERE WAS TRANSPARENCY,
WHICH IS WHAT YOU KEEP SAYING. 
          THERE ISN'T IF WE CHANGE THIS. SO DO YOU WANT TRANSPARENCY OR YOU DON'T WANT TRANSPARENCY?
THAT'S THAT'S WHAT I'M CONFUSED WITH WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO YOU DISAGREE WITH ME. 
          YOU SAY I'M WRONG, I SAY YOU'RE WRONG. BUT WHAT I'M SAYING WHAT YOU WANT TRANSPARENCY. 
          BUT THEN YOU DON'T WANT TRANSPARENCY. WHAT IS IT? I'M. WHAT I'M WILLING TO SAY IS THE IDEA IS THE IDEA IS SUPPOSED TO BE TRANSPARENT,
RIGHT? WHICH IS WHY THE $77 WAS PUT BEFORE US. BECAUSE THAT WAS TRANSPARENCY. 
          RIGHT. BUT IF THERE'S A BETTER WAY TO HAVE. BUT IF THERE'S A BETTER WAY TO HANDLE THAT
LEGALLY, MAKE US FOLLOWING STATE CODE A LITTLE BETTER AND IT BECOME AND IT'S STILL TRANSPARENT. 
          WHY WOULDN'T YOU DO THAT? BECAUSE THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS THAT $77 OVER IN THAT OTHER
ROOM DOWNSTAIRS TOOK MONEY AWAY FROM COREY'S BUDGET BECAUSE SOMEBODY HAD TO BE HERE AFTER HOURS
AND WE PAID THEM. 
          AND MAYBE FROM IT BUDGET AS WELL. SO WHAT WHAT I'M WHAT I'M DRIVING AT AND I,
AND I THINK I WANT TO TO COME UP WITH THE COMPROMISE WITH BOB IS FOR THE NON-FOR-PROFITS LEAVE THIS THE WAY IT IS AND FOR THE OTHERS THAT DON'T MEET THE STRICT DEFINITION OF NOT FOR PROFIT ENTITY,
I THINK WE CAN STILL WIGGLE AWAY. 
          BUT BUT THOSE THAT DON'T MEET THE THE STRICT DEFINITION OF WHAT WE SEE IS THE NON FOR
PROFIT ENTITY THAT WE ALLOCATE SOME MONEY IN THE BUDGET UNDER A COUNCIL LINE ITEM. 
          AND THEN IF THERE IS A REQUEST TO FUND THAT PROJECT IN THE CITY,
WE'VE ALREADY BUDGETED IT. 
          IT COMES TO US IN CONSENT. WE KNOW ABOUT IT. IF THERE'S A DISCUSSION,
WE PULL IT OFF. 
          CONSENT. WE STILL APPROVE IT. IT'S STILL TRANSPARENT,
BUT IT BETTER MEETS 1082 THAT WAY. 
          SO THE WAY I SEE WHAT YOU'RE DOING IS YOU'RE JUST MOVING THE BUDGET FROM ONE AREA TO OUR
CONTINGENCY PLAN. SO WE'RE STILL PAYING FOR IT ANYWAY. NO, THERE'S NO BUDGET. THERE'S NO BUDGET RIGHT NOW THAT WE'RE MOVING IT FROM. OKAY. 
          SO WE HAVE I THINK WE'RE TIT FOR TAT. THAT'S THE PROBLEM IS WE HAVE WHAT'S BEFORE US IN
THE CODE THAT WAS SENT OUT TO US. 
          SO WE WE CAN JUST SAY WE'RE GOING WITH THIS. BUT THAT MAY LIMIT REALLY BEING ABLE TO DO
DUMPSTER WAIVERS. 
          AND CURRENTLY, THE WAY WE'RE DOING IT, IT DOES IMPACT DIFFERENT BUDGETS IN THE CITY. 
          OR WE CAN SAY WE WANT TO DO THIS FOR NONPROFITS,
AND THEN WE WANT TO HAVE THIS OTHER PATHWAY THAT WILL WORK ON AND BRING BACK TO US IN A WORK MEETING THAT WILL ALLOW US TO STILL HAVE TRANSPARENCY BECAUSE IT WILL STILL APPEAR ON
A COUNCIL AGENDA, WILL STILL COME BEFORE US WITH A VOTE, AND THE PUBLIC WILL STILL BE ABLE TO COMMENT. 
          SO IF YOU IF YOU WANT TO DO JUST WHAT IS IN THE PACKET AND SAY,
WELL, WE MAY NEVER APPROVE ANOTHER JENNIFER ANGELIA REQUEST, PLEASE LET ME KNOW. SORRY. CAN I INTERRUPT YOU THERE? YES. NOTHING IN THE PACKET WOULD PREVENT WHAT COUNCIL MEMBER GREEN JUST SAID. 
          BUT IT. OKAY. YOU'RE RIGHT. SO? SO. BUT IT DOES IMPACT BUDGETS. 
          NOT. NOT NECESSARILY. WE BECAUSE WE WE HAVE THIS OPTION. 
          IT'S ATTACHMENT B WHERE NONPROFIT ENTITIES WOULD BE CONSIDERED FOR FEE WAIVERS UNDER
CERTAIN STEPS AND PROCEDURES. 
          THERE'S A LOT OF CLEANUP LANGUAGE THAT THE COUNCIL MEMBER GREEN WORKED ON IN THE TOP PART
OF TITLE THREE CHAPTER FOUR. 
          [01:40:05]
AND AND I THINK THAT THOSE ARE FINE. I THINK WE'RE ABLE A LOT OF WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT
WITH HANDLING INDIVIDUALS AND OTHER GROUPS WOULD BE MAYBE A COUNCIL RULES ADMINISTRATIVE SIDE OF THINGS. 
          LESS THAN CODE ITSELF. SO WHAT I WOULD BE COMFORTABLE WITH IS WHAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT. 
          ADOPT THIS PRETTY MUCH THE WAY IT IS FOR NONPROFITS. 
          BUT ESTABLISH AND MAYBE COUNCIL RULES IS THE BEST PLACE TO DO IT. 
          ESTABLISH THE COUNCIL RULES SO THAT WE BUDGET THE MONEY AND THEN WE CAN END. 
          AND EVEN IF WE BUDGET THE MONEY AS PART OF THE,
THE BUDGETING THE MONEY FOR THE PROCESS AND TRANSFERS OR EVEN DOES BUDGET AMENDMENT IF WE HAVE TO FOR, YOU KNOW, LIKE SOLID WASTE DOES. 
          CHAD WHAT'S HAPPENING IS WHEN WE WAIVE DUMPSTERS I MEAN THERE. 
          RIGHT. IT DOES PULL MONEY OUT OF THE SOLID WASTE FUND. 
          THAT'S AN ENTERPRISE FUND. AND WHAT WE WOULD BE DOING IS WE WOULD BE BY TAKING MONEY OUT
OF OUR OUT OF A BUDGET THAT WE HAD. 
          WE WOULD THEN BE TRANSFERRING IT AND MAKING KEEPING BRIAN BUDGET WHOLE. 
          IT WOULD ALSO BE THE SAME FOR POLICE. IF POLICE HAVE TO PAY OVERTIME BECAUSE THEY'RE
RUNNING SOMETHING IN THE PARK AND WE AND INSTEAD OF IF THERE'S A NOT A FEE WAIVER, A TRUE FEE WAIVER,
BUT IF THERE WAS SOMETHING LIKE THAT WE WOULD BE MAKING, WE WOULD KEEP THE POLICE BUDGET, THE FIRE BUDGET WHOLE,
AND THEY WOULDN'T HAVE TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO COVER THOSE COSTS THAT THEY'RE COVERING NOW WHEN WE WAIT. SO SO THAT GOES INTO A WHOLE DIFFERENT THING,
BECAUSE I'VE SAT THROUGH THESE FEE WAIVERS FOR, WHAT, SIX YEARS NOW? AND I'VE NEVER HAD AN ACCOUNTING THAT COMES BACK AND SAID,
OKAY, YOU KNOW WHAT? I TOOK THIS MUCH OUT OF THE POLICE ON A FIRE. 
          WE TOOK THIS MUCH. THIS IS OUR BUDGET. I'VE NEVER ONCE HEARD THE POLICE OR FIRE SAY THAT. 
          WELL, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO COMPLAIN TO US. NO,
THEY NEVER DO. 
          I THEY THEY WE WAIVE THE FEES AND THE FEES ARE WAIVED AND THE PEOPLE DON'T HAVE TO PAY IT. 
          BUT I'VE NEVER HEARD A FIRE CHIEF GO, OH, MAN,
I LOST $2,000 THAT WEEK. 
          MR. ANDERSON, IF I CAN, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO SAY THAT TO US WHEN YOU'RE TALKING SAID IT AT
ALL WHEN YOU'RE TALKING THE GENERAL FUND. 
          I DON'T THINK THAT HAS AS MUCH OF AN IMPACT AS A RESTRICTED ACCOUNT. 
          SO WHEN YOU WAIVE, FOR EXAMPLE MISS ANDERSON AND I HOPE SHE DOESN'T GET MAD THAT SHE'S THE
TOPIC TODAY. 
          SO SHE'S BEEN THE LARGEST RECIPIENT. SHE HAS. 
          SO WE WAIVE FEES OF $750 FOR AN EXPENSE BECAUSE THE COUNCIL HAS AGREED TO SUBSIDIZE THAT. 
          THAT EXPENSE IS RIGHT AROUND $3,000 FOR THOSE TEN DUMPSTERS. 
          SO YOU WAIVE 750 OF REVENUE? WE STILL PAY $3,000 OR SO TO SERVICE THOSE TEN DUMPSTERS. 
          AND THAT COMES OUT OF A RESTRICTED ACCOUNT ENTERPRISE FUND OF $3,000. 
          SHE'S BEEN DOING IT FOR TEN YEARS. SO ASSUMING THE FEES NEVER CHANGE,
THAT WOULD BE $30,000. 
          AND IF SHE GOES TEN YEARS IN THE FUTURE WITHOUT THE FEES CHANGING,
THAT'S 30,000. 
          THAT'S 60,000 THAT COMES OUT OF THAT RESTRICTED ACCOUNT,
THAT IT'S NOT THE GENERAL FUND WHERE AS YOU APPROVE THE BUDGET, YOU MOVE MONEY FROM POLICE AND FIRE AND PUBLIC WORKS AND THOSE KIND OF THINGS. 
          THE ENTERPRISE FUND, THE THE ONLY REVENUE THAT COMES IN ARE,
IS THE FEE ON THE BILL. 
          AND WHEN YOU WAIVE IT, SO OVER TIME IT'S LESS. 
          AND THEN AT SOME POINT YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO RAISE THE SOLID WASTE FEES TO COVER TO
COVER THAT. 
          RIGHT. SO THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS IN THIS. 
          AND DENISE, NOW DENISE HAS TOLD ME IT'S NOT LEGALLY REQUIRED. 
          LIKE THERE'S NO MANDATE THAT SAYS YOU HAVE TO RESTORE THE SOLID WASTE FUND,
BUT IT IS SOMETHING JUST TO BE MINDFUL OF THAT. 
          OVER TIME, AM. MORE REVENUE COMES OUT OF THE SOLID WASTE FUND AS A RESTRICTED ACCOUNT. 
          DO YOU WANT TO WAIVE THE FEE AND TAKE MONEY FOR THAT FEE WAIVER AND MAKE SOLID WASTE
WHOLE? AND I WOULD SAY THAT WITH ANY OF THE DISTRICT,
I DON'T THINK YOU'LL HAVE FEE WAIVERS FOR WATER. AND I DON'T THINK YOU'LL HAVE FEE WAIVERS FOR SEWER. BUT THE DUMPSTER IS ONE AND IT WOULD PROVIDE A PATHWAY. 
          WE DID HAVE A FEE WAIVER FOR STORMWATER. WE DO. 
          AND YOU DO. HAVE YOU REMEMBER THE GOLF COURSE OVER AT SANDY? OVER. AND SANDY? YEAH. AND YOU HAVE CODE FROM WHEN MAYOR RALPH WAS HERE. 
          YOU HAVE CODE FOR IF IF A STORM DETENTION BASIN FLOODS SOMETHING. 
          THERE'S A RESTORATION SECTION OF CODE THAT RESTORES PROPERTY WHEN A STORM OR NINE,
EIGHT, NINE. OR DO YOU REMEMBER THAT ONE? SO THERE IS THERE ARE PROVISIONS LIKE THAT,
AND THOSE IMPACT THE RESTRICTED ACCOUNTS. 
          THAT'S THAT'S PART OF THIS DISCUSSION, I THINK. 
          [01:45:05]
NOT LEGALLY REQUIRED, BUT IT'S YOUR DISCRETION. 
          I JUST THINK IT WOULD BE EASIER ON OUR STAFF TO NOT HAVE TO DO FEE WAIVERS FOR THE
DUMPSTERS OR FOR THE ROOM USE, AND HAVE A DIFFERENT PATHWAY FOR THOSE THINGS THAT,
TO ME, STILL MAKE IT. 
          VERY VISIBLE FOR THE PUBLIC, BUT A LITTLE LESS INTENSE WORK FOR STAFF AND IS TO ME,
IT WOULD BE EASIER BUDGETING TO TO KNOW THAT. MY RESTRICTED ACCOUNT IS BEING MADE WHOLE AGAIN. 
          I THINK WHAT YOU'RE ASKING FOR IS ANOTHER BUDGET FOR FEE WAIVERS. 
          YEAH. IT'S JUST PUTTING MONEY IN A DIFFERENT LINE. 
          YES. SO IF WE HAVE A DIFFERENT PATH, IF WE HAVE 60,000 FOR CONTINGENCY,
ARE YOU SAYING? LET'S ADD ANOTHER BUDGET? OR DO YOU WANT US TO TAKE OUT A CONTINGENCY AND MAKE A FEE
WAIVER BUDGET? THAT'S WHAT I'M ASKING YOU. I WOULD PUT A DIFFERENT LINE IF IT WERE ME, BECAUSE THAT'S A WHOLE DIFFERENT DISCUSSION THAN WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE TONIGHT. I WOULD
PUT IT ON A DIFFERENT LINE THAN OUR CONTINGENCY LINE. I ALMOST FEEL LIKE WE NEED TO HAVE A WHOLE NOTHER DISCUSSION ABOUT TO CREATE A NEW BUDGET LINE. 
          YES. MAYBE I JUST NEED TO GO BACK TO MAYBE A FEE FOR THE DUMPSTERS LIKE CHRIS ALWAYS
WANTED TO DO. 
          WE DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THIS 350 SOMETHING THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS THAT. 
          BUT IT'S LIKE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, LIKE THIS ONE FEE THAT ONE PERSON COMES IN AND ASKS FOR
ONCE A YEAR. 
          AND AS IF THAT'S LIKE EXHIBIT A, B, C, D, AND E INSTEAD OF INSTEAD OF LET'S LOOK AT A
POLICY, LET'S LOOK AT A. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. 
          I THINK RIGHT HERE IS HOW DO WE HOW DO WE FOLLOW STATE CODE FOR WHAT 1082 SAYS? AND THEN HOW DO WE ALSO MAKE SOMETHING AVAILABLE THAT DOESN'T REALLY FOLLOW THAT,
BUT IS STILL TRANSPARENT FOR OUR RESIDENTS WANT TO, OR WHAT THAT POLICY SHOULD LOOK LIKE? I THINK WE'RE STARTING IN THE WEEDS,
AND WE HAVEN'T EVEN GOTTEN TO THE 30,000 FOOT LEVEL YET TO SEE WHAT FEES SHOULD BE WAIVED. 
          WHAT FEES DO WE WANT TO WAIVE? ARE THERE ARE THERE FEES THAT WE WANT TO WAIVE AND FEES
THAT WE DON'T WANT TO WAIVE, JUST AS A MATTER OF COURSE. 
          IS THERE CATEGORIES OF FEES THAT WE SAY, NO,
WE'RE NOT GOING TO WAIVE THOSE, BUT WE WILL WAIVE THESE. AND IF SO, WHY ARE WE CHARGING THESE IN THE FIRST PLACE? THAT'S THE DISCUSSION THAT I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE ABOVE THAT. 
          1082 DOESN'T ADDRESS THAT. IT SAYS YOU CAN WAIVE FEES. 
          SO I, I THINK THAT MAY BE SOMETHING THAT I MEAN,
YEAH, WE COULD PUT CODE TOGETHER THAT CAPTURES ALL OF THAT. 
          OR YOU COULD DECIDE THAT ON A REQUEST BY REQUEST BASIS IN THE WAY THAT YOU HAVE SO FAR. 
          WELL, AND I THINK THE LEGISLATIVE DISCRETION IS BASED ON 1082 IS THE COUNCIL GETS TO
DECIDE WHAT FEES ARE WAIVED IF YOU WANT TO PUT IT. 
          YEAH, YEAH. FOR NONPROFIT IF IF WE'RE IF WE'RE IF WE GET IN THE WEEDS,
IT SAYS, WELL, FOR NONPROFITS WE'RE GOING TO WAIVE THIS FEE AND WE WON'T WAIVE THAT FEE. 
          I THINK THAT TAKES AWAY FROM THE 1082, THE NATURE OF 1082 TO SAY IF THE NONPROFITS
REQUESTING A FEE WAIVER. 
          I THINK WE NEED TO LOOK AT THE FEE WAIVER AS A WHOLE AND NOT SAY,
OH, WE'RE GOING TO ELIMINATE NOT, NOT DO THIS, BUT WE WILL DO THAT. THERE'S THERE'S ONE OTHER OPTION NOT TO MAKE IT MORE
COMPLEX THAN IT ALREADY IS, BUT MOST OF THE SCHOOL DISTRICTS DO TWO FEES. 
          ONE IS FOR CIVILIANS, ANYBODY. AND AND THE OTHER LINE IS FOR NONPROFITS. 
          IF YOU ARE A NONPROFIT ENTITY, YOU GET A MUCH REDUCED FEE FOR FACILITY USE THROUGH THE
SCHOOL DISTRICTS. 
          WHAT YOU COULD DO, WE DO THAT NOW IN OUR CONSOLIDATED FEE SCHEDULE. 
          YOU COULD YOU COULD MAKE IT MORE COMPLETE ACROSS THE BOARD TO JUST SAY WE'RE NOT WAIVING
FEES NECESSARILY. 
          WE'RE CHOOSING NOT TO WAIVE FEES, BUT WE'RE MAKING IT VERY,
VERY, VERY LOW FOR NONPROFIT ENTITIES. 
          AND IT WOULD SIMPLIFY SOME OF THIS, NOT ALL OF IT,
BUT I WOULD ALSO SAY NONE OF WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED IN THE CODE WOULD PROHIBIT YOU FROM HAVING A CONVERSATION ABOUT WHAT FEES ARE WAIVED,
WHAT FEES ARE WAIVED, HOW DO WE TREAT THIS ORGANIZATION VERSUS THAT ORGANIZATION? THOSE ARE POLICY DECISIONS SEPARATE FROM FROM THE LEGISLATIVE. 
          OKAY. SO THIS IS MY QUESTION FOR THE BODY. ARE THERE ANY CONCERNS WITH WHAT IS BEFORE US,
WHAT PATRICK HAS PRESENTED NOW? IF THERE ARE, PLEASE ACKNOWLEDGE I HAVE THE I HAVE THE CONCERN OF IF WE DON'T ADD THE
OTHER PIECE TO IT, THE CONCERN WITH THE WAY THAT THAT 3 OR 4FT,
WHATEVER IT IS, THREE, FOUR, THREE A JUST IS THE REQUIREMENT FOR FEE WAIVERS. 
          HERE'S THE NONPROFIT ONE, BUT DOESN'T SAY THERE'S ANY OTHER REQUIREMENTS FOR FEE WAIVER. 
          OKAY. SO THERE'S THAT'S GOTTA BE THAT'S GOTTA BE FLESHED OUT. 
          [01:50:01]
SO SO SO COUNCIL MEMBER JACOB, IS THAT WHERE YOU'D LIKE TO PUT MAYBE SOME OF THE POLICY
CONSIDERATIONS FOR NONPROFITS? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? NO, NO, NO, NONPROFIT SEEMS TO BE COVERED. 
          COVERED. I'M TALKING ABOUT EVERYBODY ELSE, NOT NONPROFITS. 
          WE CAN'T DO FEE WAIVERS UNDER 1082 FOR ANYBODY ELSE. 
          OKAY, JENNIFER AND I HATE TO DO THAT. I KNOW,
LIKE LIKE WE SHOULDN'T HAVE BEEN DOING THAT. 
          LIKE JOSH SAID, WE'RE WE'RE TRYING TO WE'RE TRYING TO BRING IT MORE IN LINE WITH WHAT 1082
ALLOWS. 
          AND 1082 ONLY SAYS NONPROFITS, RIGHT? AND SO THAT'S WHY THIS ONLY SAYS NONPROFITS. 
          SO SO JUST DON'T WAIVE FEES FOR FOR NON NONPROFIT FOR FOR I DON'T WANT TO CALL THEM
PROFITS BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT ALL PROFITS. 
          THAT'S THAT'S I MEAN I THINK THAT'S THE FOR GROUPS THAT AREN'T VOLUNTEERS THAT ARE NOT FOR
PROFIT ORGANIZATIONS OR NONPROFIT. 
          SO THAT'S WHERE THAT'S WHERE THE THE CONTINGENCY FUNDS WOULD BE USED TO COVER FEES FOR
INDIVIDUALS AND OTHER ENTITIES IN THE CITY, NONPROFIT THAT THESE PEOPLE JUST FLOW INTO AS THEY COME IN AND NEED TO TAKE TIME OFF
STAFF. 
          IN FACT, THAT'S WHY I HAD THE ORIGINAL POLICY,
NOT PROFIT ORGANIZATION, RECOGNIZED BY THE CITY TO TRY TO THROW IT UNDER THERE. 
          YEAH. I MEAN, IF IF THERE'S I MEAN, YOUR, YOUR,
YOUR MECHANISM MIGHT LOOK THE SAME AS WHAT WE'VE BEEN DISCUSSING FOR ACCESSING THOSE FUNDS. IF YOU WERE TO SAY, HERE'S A NONPROFIT ENTITY THAT'S MAYBE ORGANIZED BY THE CITY
AND YOU JOIN IN WITH US. 
          AND THAT IS SEPARATE FOR THOSE OTHER REASONS. 
          THE WAY THAT IT'S WRITTEN THEN SHOULDN'T SAY,
WELL, FOR NONPROFIT ENTITIES AND THEN HAVE A LIST IF IT'S ONLY NONPROFIT ENTITIES. 
          YEAH. INITIALLY WE WE DID HAVE THE DIFFERENT CATEGORIES AND WE HAD CUT IT UP AND THAT'S
GOING TO NEED A REWORK. 
          I'M CHANNELING MY INNER KELVIN TO SAY YOU GOTTA REWRITE THAT. 
          SO WE'LL MASSAGE. YEAH, WE'LL WORK IT. YES. I HAVEN'T ENTERED KELVIN. 
          DON'T TELL ANYBODY. BUT BESIDES THAT, THEN. YEAH. 
          THEN WE NEED. THEN WE NEED A POLICY, OR WE NEED A BUDGET OR WE NEED SOMETHING IF WE WANT
TO CONTINUE TO WAIVE FEES FOR SOMEBODY. 
          BUT IT'S NOT HERE. OKAY. NO, NO. AND I DON'T THINK I WOULD RECOMMEND THAT YOU PUT IT HERE
SO I CAN. 
          I'M HOPING TO FIND OUT WHETHER OR NOT THE COUNCIL DOES AGREE WITH YOU ON THAT,
SO THAT WE CAN CRAFT SOMETHING. 
          I AGREE DIRECTION ON WHAT THE COUNCIL WOULD LIKE. 
          SO YEAH, WE NEED A POLICY OR AND WE NEED A POLICY AND A BUDGET. 
          OKAY. THIS IS HOW YOU DO IT AND THIS IS HOW MUCH WE'RE WILLING TO SPEND ON IT PER YEAR.
OKAY. AND WE CAN MAKE IT 1% OKAY OR HALF OF ONE. 
          SO WE'RE OKAY WITH THIS BECAUSE WE KNOW WE LEGALLY NEED TO. 
          RIGHT. AND THEN WE WANT TO REQUEST THAT WE WORK ON A POLICY FOR US AND A WAY TO ALLOW
DISTRIBUTION OF FUNDS FOR OTHER PEOPLE THAT DON'T, THAT DON'T MEET THESE CRITERIA,
INDIVIDUALS THAT REQUEST THEM. 
          SO, YES IN TWO, SIX, THREE, SORRY, IS IT THE INTENT OF THE COUNCIL THAT THE REQUIREMENTS
UNDER TWO, SIX, THREE APPLY TO ENTITIES RECEIVING $5,000 OR MORE IN CITY SUPPORT,
SPECIFICALLY MONETARY CITY SUPPORT OR IN-KIND, LIKE DO YOU WANT 5000 IN IN-KIND OR MONETARY OR JUST MONETARY? WE SHOULD BE KIND TO EVERYBODY. SEE, I WILL TELL YOU,
CORBIN, MY, I HAD A PROBLEM. 
          I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THIS PARTICULAR SECTION OF CODE WHEN IT SAYS THAT THEY'LL PROVIDE
YEARLY FINANCIAL REPORTS IN A FORM ACCEPTABLE TO CITY COUNCIL. IT IF IF,
FOR EXAMPLE, THE, THE JORDAN EDUCATION FOUNDATION WILL COST MORE THAN $5,000 TO WAIVE. NOW, THEY'RE GENERALLY PRETTY GOOD ABOUT SAYING HERE,
BUT YOU CAN ALREADY SEE THEIR BOOKS. 
          THEY'RE A PUBLIC ENTITY. WELL, SHOW THEM TO US. 
          BUT IT SAYS THAT THEY WILL PROVIDE A YEARLY FINANCIAL REPORT FOR THAT. 
          THEY DO. WHEN YOU CONNECT TO US, I COULD ADD THE PHRASE,
YOU KNOW, WHEN REQUESTED BY THE COUNCIL OR UPON REQUEST OF THE COUNCIL OR SOME, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN YOU'RE RESERVING THE RIGHT FOR THESE THINGS,
NOT FORCING THAT THEY HAVE TO DO IT. 
          BUT ISN'T THAT JUST RELATED TO THE AMOUNT OF THE FUNDS THEY RECEIVE FROM THE CITY? LIKE LIKE CITY COULDN'T GO AND AUDIT WHAT THEY GET FROM SAP OR OTHER ENTITIES. 
          IT'S JUST THE CITY FUNDS, RIGHT? RIGHT. BUT WE DO NEED TO ANSWER MR. LEE'S QUESTION. IS THIS JUST MONETARY, OR IS THIS ALSO BECAUSE YOU'RE RIGHT,
THE WORD SAYS CITY SUPPORT, RIGHT? AND IF IT'S IF IT'S CITY FUNDS AND WE CHANGE THE WORD 5000 MORE IN CITY FUNDS. 
          THEN, THEN WE'RE NOT DEALING WITH THE IN-KIND AND THE NON-MONETARY,
AND WE WOULDN'T NEED TO REPORT. 
          I COULD I, I THINK I KNOW WHERE YOU'RE GOING. 
          I DON'T CARE WHICH WAY. I JUST WANT YOU TO BE CLEAR ON WHETHER THIS APPLIES TO THE IN-KIND
DONATIONS OR NOT. 
          [01:55:07]
NOW, I THINK IT WOULD APPLY BECAUSE IT JUST SAYS CITY SUPPORT. 
          SO DO WE WANT IT CHANGED TO CITY FUNDS? CITY FUNDS? YEAH I DO ONE, TWO. I'M GOOD WITH THAT. I JUST THINK THAT'S THAT BRINGS UP THE FUZZY SPOT
THOUGH, THAT CHAD WAS TALKING ABOUT. AS FAR AS WHEN IS IT A CITY FUND? IF A POLICE OFFICER HAS TO WORK OVERTIME TO BE THERE,
THEN IS IT? SO THIS WOULD ACTUALLY BE CASH EXPENDITURE. IS THIS IS THIS CASH HANDED TO A INDIVIDUAL OR
ENTITY OR NONPROFIT OR WHATEVER? THIS IS LIKE MONEY GIVEN TO THE ARTS OR THE MUSEUM. 
          RIGHT. OKAY. SO IF IF SO, IF WE CHANGE THE WORD CITY SUPPORT TO SOMETHING THAT SAYS DIRECT
CONTACT, DIRECT FUNDS, DIRECT MONETARY, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          I DON'T CARE WHAT MONETARY. MAYBE THAT'S THE BEST WAY TO GO CHANGE SUPPORT TO FUNDS. 
          THAT'S ALL YOU HAVE TO DO. EITHER ADD A WORD OR CHANGE A WORD. 
          DID YOU WANT IT MANDATORY ON ALL BILLS IN ALL CASES,
OR DID YOU WANT TO AT YOUR DISCRETION ON ON THESE? IF IT'S JUST MONEY, IF IT'S IF IT'S THE CASH COUNCIL CAN WAIVE THIS IF WE HAVE A POLICY
AND IF IT'S FOR EVERYONE, IF IT'S CASH, I'M OKAY WITH THE REPORT. IF IT'S THE NON CASH,
THAT'S WHERE YOU START TO HAVE THE FUZZY REPORTING. 
          BECAUSE THEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT JORDAN EDUCATION FOUNDATION OR SOME OF THESE OTHERS. 
          AND SO I'M OKAY WITH THE MANDATORY REPORT IF IT'S CASH ONLY OKAY. 
          SO GOOD. THANKS FOR BRINGING THAT UP BECAUSE I WAS GOING TO TALK ABOUT THAT AND I FORGOT. 
          DID YOU SAY THAT? YES, I'M SURE THAT'S RIGHT. OKAY,
SO YOU'VE GOT SHELTON. 
          GREEN. WHITE. LIGHT GREEN GREEN GREEN SHELTON. 
          GREEN. JACOBS. COUNCIL MEMBER. BLOOM, YOU HAVE YOU ANYTHING TO ADD? YOU KNOW CALVIN AND OTHERS COVERED MY NOTES. I WAS I WAS,
LIKE, THINKING, TALKING ABOUT WHEN WE GET TO THAT POINT ABOUT SUBSIDIZING INDIVIDUALS OR GROUPS WITH OUR OWN BUDGET DISCRETIONARY FUNDS,
THAT WAS ONE OF THE NOTES THAT I HAD. 
          I DID HAVE A QUESTION ON IN THE CODE, DO DOES IT MAKE IT CLEAR WHEN AUDITS ARE REQUIRED? I COULDN'T REALLY TELL WHEN I WAS READING THROUGH. I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT
LANGUAGE IS CLEAR. 
          SO SO THE THAT SECTION, IT'S IT'S TWO, SIX, THREE. 
          A AND THE LANGUAGE IS THE REQUESTING INDIVIDUAL OR ENTITY SHALL PERMIT THE CITY OR AN
AUDITOR HIRED BY THE CITY TO INSPECT THE INDIVIDUAL OR ENTITIES SYSTEM OF ACCOUNTS AND OTHER ACCOUNTING SYSTEMS AND PROTOCOLS TO ENSURE ACCURACY
AND PROPER SAFEGUARDING. 
          SO I DON'T KNOW THAT IT'S AN AUDIT. I DON'T KNOW THAT PEOPLE ARE OPENING THEMSELVES UP TO
THEIR INDIVIDUAL FINANCES BEING AUDITED AS MUCH AS IT IS ALLOWING US OR OUR AUDITOR TO INSPECT THE WAY THAT THEY MANAGE THEIR FUNDS AND THEIR PROCESSES. 
          AND SO IT'S NOT ALLOWING AN AUDIT PER SE, OF THEIR BOOKS AS MUCH AS IT IS ALLOWING US TO
AUDIT OR TO EXAMINE HOW THEY MANAGE THEIR, THEIR FUNDS. SO I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT WAS CLEAR ON HOW THAT
READ. 
          AND AS FAR AS WHEN THAT QUOTE UNQUOTE AUDIT IS REQUIRED,
WOULD IT MAKE MORE SENSE TO IF WE IF WE CHANGE THAT WORDING IN THAT ABOUT ALLOWING THE AUDITOR TO LOOK AND EXAMINE HOW
THE CITY FUNDS WERE DISBURSED OR SPENT. NOT THE WHOLE. 
          NOT THEIR ENTIRE BOOKS, BUT JUST WHAT IT SAYS. 
          TO ENSURE ACCURACY AND PROPER SAFEGUARDING OF PUBLIC FUNDS? NO. I HAVE TO MY NONPROFIT WHEN I GET A GRANT FROM A CITY,
OR FROM A COUNTY OR FROM OR FROM WHATEVER, I GOTTA GIVE THEM THE NOT THE WHOLE BOOKS, BUT THE BUT A GOOD SUMMARY OF THE ENTIRE
BUDGET. 
          WHEN FUNDS ARE CO-MINGLED, YOU'RE LOOKING AT ALL OF IT ANYWAYS. 
          OKAY. CAN I ASK, THOUGH? I READ TWO, SIX, THREE A AS IT GIVES THE CITY THE ABILITY,
BUT IT'S NOT A REQUIREMENT OF THE CITY TO DO. IS THAT YOUR INTENT? COUNCIL. YEAH. YES. I'LL PERMIT THAT. IT DOESN'T SAY WE WILL. 
          YEAH. BECAUSE I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE IT'S NOT AN OBLIGATION OF THE STAFF TO DO IT. 
          NO, BECAUSE. BECAUSE I THINK IF WE WERE GOING TO DO THAT,
WE WOULD HAVE TO AUTHORIZE THE FUNDS BECAUSE IT'S EXPENSIVE. 
          YEAH, I THINK THE I THINK THE NOT FOR PROFIT SHOULD AGREE TO THAT. 
          YES. IF WE DECIDE IF WE COLLECTIVELY DECIDED,
YEAH, WE NEED AN AUDITOR, WE'LL PAY FOR IT. 
          BUT IF WE DON'T NEED AN AUDITOR, THEN I THINK THE YEARLY FINANCIAL REPORT IS SUFFICIENT,
DON'T YOU? THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING. AND I THINK THAT'S I LIKE THAT. 
          I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WAS YOUR INTENT. OKAY. 
          [02:00:01]
SO ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. BOYCE OR MR.. MR. BOYCE OR MR. ANDERSON? OKAY. PUT SOMETHING TOGETHER, THAT POLICY,
AND THEN WE'LL COME BACK AND WE'LL HAVE MORE FUN ON ANOTHER NIGHT. STAY TUNED. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. 
          THANKS FOR STEPPING UP TO THE TABLE WITH US,
PATRICK. 
          WE APPRECIATE YOU. ALWAYS HAPPY TO STICK AROUND FOR THE NEXT ONE. 
          I'M GOING TO BE THE NEXT ONE. IS A DISCUSSION ON OF REGULATIONS NATION ON ELECTRIC
MICRO-MOBILITY VEHICLES. 
          [d.
 Discussion of Regulations on Electric Micro-Mobility Vehicles]
AND I HAVE COUNCIL MEMBER SHELTON AMADOR. AND I'LL TELL YOU,
SOME OF THESE WERE USED IN A PLAY LAST NIGHT THAT I WATCHED. 
          SO SOME O THE ELECTRIC THINGS, THEY LOOK LIKE UNICYCLES UNDER THE COSTUMES IS WHAT THEY
LOOK LIKE. 
          SO THIS THIS CAME UP. I'LL BE HONEST, IT CAME UP WHEN I WAS HAVING A DISCUSSION WITH MY
BROTHER ABOUT MY BROTHER. DON IS A COUNCIL MEMBER IN SOUTH JORDAN. 
          I ASKED HIM ABOUT HIS THOUGHTS ON ON THE GOLF CART THING THAT WE'VE BEEN CONSIDERING. AND HE SAID, WELL, THE THING WE'RE FOCUSING ON RIGHT NOW IS WE'RE DEALING
WITH CHILDREN. 
          WE'RE DEALING WITH CHILDREN USING TIRED, HE'S SUPER FAST ELECTRIC MOTORCYCLES AND SO ON
RIDING THROUGH THE CITY, GETTING INTO ACCIDENTS AND,
AND CAUSING ALL KINDS OF MAYHEM, IF YOU WILL, IF YOU'RE FAMILIAR WITH THE ADVERTISEMENT. NICE JOB. 
          SO, ANYWAY SOUTH JORDAN CITY BASICALLY COPIED STATE CODE WHEN THEY CREATED THEIR CITY CODE,
WITH THE CAVEAT OF THEY WANT TO THEY WANT TO MAKE SURE THE STATE. I DON'T THINK STATE CODE REALLY AND I,
I SKIMMED THROUGH IT, BUT I DON'T BELIEVE STATE CODE ADDRESSES THE ELECTRIC MOTORCYCLES. 
          THAT'S THE THE BASICALLY, IT'S CONSIDERED OFF ROAD VEHICLES. 
          BASICALLY A MOTORCYCLE THAT DOESN'T HAVE PEDALS. 
          SO THE ELECTRIC BIKE DOES NOT HAVE PEDALS. IT'S CONSIDERED TO BE A YES. 
          YES. AND THEY CAN GO AS FAST AS, AS 60, 70 MILES AN HOUR OR MORE. 
          AND SO THERE ARE MOTOR ACCORDING TO YOUR ATTACHMENT. 
          THAT'S A IT'S A MOTORCYCLE. SO THAT'S PROBABLY WHY STATE CODE DOESN'T ADDRESS IT IS
BECAUSE IT'S CONSIDERED A REGULAR MOVING VEHICLE WHERE YOU'D BE REQUIRED TO HAVE A LICENSE TO DRIVE IT LIKE ANY OTHER MOTORCYCLE. 
          A LOT OF PARENTS DON'T SEEM TO FEEL THAT WAY. 
          CHILDREN IN OUR CITY ARE USING THOSE MOTORCYCLES. 
          BE HONEST, CHILDREN IN OUR CITY ARE USING GAS POWERED MOTORCYCLES. 
          YEAH, BUT THERE'S. THE THING IS, I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT IT'S BEING ENFORCED THE SAME WAY
IN EDUCATION. LIKE A CHILD MIGHT GET ON A GAS POWERED MOTORCYCLE,
DRIVE IT THROUGH THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND SEE A POLICE OFFICER AND AND BE LIKE, OH NO, I'M IN TROUBLE. BUT THEY MIGHT NOT THINK TWICE ABOUT DRIVING THROUGH A NEIGHBORHOOD
ON AN ELECTRIC. 
          YOU MEAN THEY WON'T THINK TWICE BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE TO? WHAT'S THAT? THEY WON'T THINK TWICE BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO. AS FAR AS THEY'RE CONCERNED,
THEY THINK IT'S LEGAL. I DON'T THINK THAT'S WHAT I MEANT. I DON'T THINK THEY THOUGHT THAT'S WHAT I MEANT WAS I DIDN'T THINK. YOU'RE RIGHT THERE. 
          THEY WON'T EVEN THINK ONCE. YEAH. SO PART OF THE REASON SOUTH JORDAN DID THIS EVEN THOUGH
IT'S IT'S JUST COPYING STATE CODE IN LARGE PART IS BECAUSE OF THEY WANT ENHANCED ENFORCEMENT AND SAFETY ON THE STREETS,
AND, AND THEY ALSO WANT TO ENHANCE THE EDUCATION COMPONENT FOR THE CITY,
LIKE COUNCIL MEMBER JACOB BROUGHT UP WHEN WE HAD OUR IMPROMPTU DISCUSSION ON THIS A FEW WEEKS AGO. HEY, CAN WE HAVE POLICE OFFICERS CARRY A FLIER OR AN INFORMATIVE FLIER WITH THEM? WE HAVE SHOPS THAT SELL THESE TYPES OF BICYCLES. GIVE THEM SOME, SOME SORT OF INFORMATION SHEET THAT CAN EDUCATE THE. 
          RESIDENTS WHO ARE MAKING THESE PURCHASES. AND SOUTH JORDAN ALSO HAS DEDICATED WEBSITE 
          [02:05:05]
FOR THIS. SO ANYWAY, I'M NOT I WON'T SAY THAT I'M GREATLY EMOTIONALLY ATTACHED TO THIS IDEA, BUT I THINK IT IT I AM CONCERNED ABOUT THE SAFETY OF
OUR RESIDENTS. 
          AND IN FACT, WE GOT A I RECEIVED AN EMAIL FROM THE MAYOR JUST BEFORE THIS MEETING STARTED. 
          I'LL PULL IT UP AND READ IT TO YOU. IT SAYS SO THIS IS AN EMAIL THAT WAS FORWARDED TO THE MAYOR FROM BRIAN CLEGG. 
          AND IT SAYS HE WAS ASKED TO MORE ASPHALT OR CONCRETE. 
          NO. HE SAYS I WAS ASKED TO SEND THIS TO YOU FROM A RESIDENT. 
          THERE WAS A CHILD GOING 40MPH ON A SIDEWALK AND ALMOST HIT A ANOTHER CHILD THAT WAS
PLAYING NEAR THE SIDEWALK. 
          AND THE CONSTITUENT SAYS THAT THEY ARE CONTINUALLY SEEING THIS AND THEY'RE CONCERNED THAT
SOMEONE IS GOING TO GET HURT. 
          AND SO YOU CAN SHOW IT IF YOU WANT, WHAT DO WE HAVE ANY DATA ON? ACCIDENTS, INJURIES OR COMPLAINTS INVOLVING E-BIKES AND SCOOTERS? LOTS OF COMPLAINTS. YEAH, JUST LIKE THE ANSWER IS NO. 
          IS IT E-BIKES OR IS IT THE MOTORCYCLES? IT'S MOTORCYCLES I THINK ARE THE BIGGEST ISSUE. 
          BUT E-BIKES THOSE ARE OLDER. WE NEED TO BE SURE THAT WE'RE ENFORCING STATE STATUTE WHICH
IS, YOU KNOW, ANY CHILD EIGHT YEARS OR YOUNGER IS NOT ALLOWED TO USE AN ELECTRIFIED BICYCLE OF
ANY KIND. 
          AND THEN IF YOU HAVE TO BE 16 OR OLDER TO USE A CLASS THREE ELECTRIC BICYCLE AND I THINK 12 OR 14 TO USE A CLASS TWO ELECTRIC ELECTRIFIED BICYCLE? YES. I DON'T KNOW IF THE ATTACHMENT HERE IS SUPPOSED TO BE A PROPOSED HANDOUT OR ANYTHING, BUT ALL IT IS, IS DEFINITIONS. THERE'S NO. YEAH,
THERE'S NO REGULATION. 
          THERE'S NO. LIKE THIS IS WHAT A CLASS ONE. THIS IS WHAT A CLASS TWO IS. 
          AND THIS IS WHAT A CLASS THREE IS. AND THIS IS WHAT AN ELECTRIC MOTORCYCLE IS. OKAY. 
          THE ONLY THE ONE THING IS I HAVE IS I HELP COUNCIL MEMBER SHELDON PUT THIS TOGETHER. 
          THE E-BIKES ARE THE ONLY THINGS THAT ARE CLASSIFIED. 
          EVERYTHING ELSE IS NOT CLASSIFIED. BUT THE USERS AND MANUFACTURERS CLASSIFY THEM BY WHEEL
DIAMETER. 
          THOSE TYPE OF THINGS. THERE WAS SOMEONE I CAN'T REMEMBER WHO IN CABINET MEETING. 
          THERE IS SOMEBODY IN WEST JORDAN THAT DOES RIDE A UNICYCLE IN A LANE OF TRAFFIC. 
          YOU SAW ONE ON OR 78 E UNICYCLE? WELL, IT'S NOT LIKE UNICYCLE. 
          IT'S JUST THOSE ONE WHEELS. THEY HAVE THE GYROSCOPE IN THEM. OH WELL IT'S A,
IT'S A, IT'S A ONE WHEEL WITH A YOU STAND ON EITHER SIDE OF IT. 
          AND I WAS KIND OF LIKE TO SEGUE, BUT IT'S NOT. 
          IT'S LIKE A ONE WHEELED SEGWAY. YEAH, YEAH. BUT IT'S GOT GYROSCOPES TO KEEP IT BALANCED. 
          THERE'S, THERE'S VIDEOS OF OF THOSE UNICYCLES THAT ARE TRAVELING IN LANE OF LANE OF TRAVEL
THAT ARE DOING 70 AND 80 MILES AN HOUR, 70 ON A UNICYCLE. AGAIN, IT'S NOT WHAT YOU THINK OF WHEN YOU THINK OF UNICYCLE,
BUT STILL 70 ON ONE OF THOSE IS PRETTY FAST. BUT IT'S SCARY THAT THAT'S NOT HOW THE MANUFACTURERS THAT UNPROTECTED. 
          YEAH. LET'S SAY IN THIS LAST WEEK I'VE HAD THREE NIGHTS WHERE SO IT'S DARK. 
          I'VE GOT A GUY ON ONE OF THOSE ONE WHEEL THINGS THAT GOES DOWN 2200 WEST WITH NO LIGHTS OF
ANY KIND. 
          AND THE FIRST TIME I WAS CROSSING THE STREET WITH MY DOG AND HAD TO PULL MY DOG BACK
BECAUSE I DIDN'T EVEN HEAR OR SEE ANYTHING. 
          AND ALL OF A SUDDEN, I JUST. I CAUGHT MOVEMENT IN MY PERIPHERAL AND PULLED MY DOG BACK,
AND THIS GUY WHIZZED BY. I'M NOT GOING TO SAY HE WAS GOING ON 70. BUT I DON'T THINK HE WAS GOING THE SPEED LIMIT, WHICH IS 30. I THINK HE WAS ABOVE THAT. 
          BUT NOW I'VE LOOKED OUT FOR HIM BECAUSE I'VE SEEN HIM TWO MORE NIGHTS SINCE THAT. 
          SO I THINK OUR THING IS MORE THAN JUST THESE BIKES. 
          THEIR VEHICLES OF ANY KIND. HERE'S THE COUNCIL MEMBER BLOOM. 
          WHAT DID YOU SAY? OH, I WAS JUST SAYING. IF THEY'RE GOING 70 MILES ON THERE,
THEY'RE HACKING IT. 
          YEAH. YEAH, THEY MAKE MODIFICATIONS FOR MY KIDS HAVE. 
          SO IS THAT A LITTLE KID IN THE VIDEO? DO WE KNOW THAT BIKE'S GOING A LITTLE FAST? SOME OF THE CARS THAT HE WAS DOING 35 TO 40 MILES AN HOUR. 
          40. THAT'S GUYS RUNNING TO GET HIS KID. YEAH,
WELL, AND THAT SHOULD BE AND AND IT SHOULDN'T MATTER IF THAT'S AN ELECTRICALLY PROPELLED 
          [02:10:08]
BIKE OR A GASOLINE POWERED BIKE. AGREED. YEAH. 
          THAT'S AGREED. THAT'S JUST NOT, YOU KNOW. SO,
WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GETTING ALL THESE NEW THINGS THAT BECAUSE WE'RE GOVERNMENT, WE GET TO WEIGH IN ON. DO WE WANT TO WEIGH IN ON IT? THAT'S REALLY THE FIRST QUESTION. DO WE WANT TO CREATE A POLICY FOR ALL THESE? SOUTH JORDAN IS IN GENERAL MORE AFFLUENT THAN WEST JORDAN IS. 
          AND I THINK THEY'VE HAD MORE TROUBLE WITH THIS THAN WE HAVE. 
          IT'S COMING. IT'S COMING OUR DIRECTION. MY NEIGHBORHOOD IS NOT AFFLUENT. 
          AND THOSE KIDS HAVE THOSE MOTORCYCLES, BUT THEY'VE ALSO HAD PROBLEMS. AND IT SOUNDS LIKE WHAT I'M WORRIED ABOUT IS THAT THAT THE MOTORCYCLES AND STUFF RIPPING
OUT PARTS THEY ALREADY DO IN PARKS. 
          THE ISSUE WITH THE DIFFERENCE. AND I HAVE A MOTORCYCLE. 
          MY SON DOES. HE'S ONE OF THOSE HOODLUMS. YES. 
          HE IS NOT IN THIS CITY, SO DON'T WORRY. BUT THE DIFFERENCE OF AN ELECTRIC AND A GAS IS THE
TALK. 
          THOSE ELECTRIC MOTORCYCLES HAVE AN EXTREME AMOUNT OF TORQUE. 
          AND WHEN THEY'RE IN A PARK. I'VE EVEN DONE ALL IT TAKES IS A LITTLE AND IT RIPS UP THE
GRASS, IT TEARS IT, THEY JUMP. SO I'M GOING TO ALLOW GAS POWERED ONES TO BE GOING ON. 
          BUT THE GAS POWERED I MEAN THEY'RE LOUD NEIGHBORS CALL MY SONS,
GO WITH TEN FRIENDS. 
          THEY'VE BEEN AT NIGHT JUMPING BASINS. THEY'VE. 
          YEP. I'VE YELLED AT HIM. HE'S BEEN GROUNDED. SO BECAUSE YOU DON'T HEAR THEM. 
          SO THAT'S. AND THE TALK THAT IT CAUSES EXTREME AMOUNT OF DAMAGE IN THE PARKS. 
          WELL, I DON'T WANT A GAS POWERED ONES PARKS EITHER. 
          MAYOR. I'VE READ THAT ONE. THE SEGWAY. I RIDE THE JORDAN RIVER TRAIL QUITE A BIT ON MY
BICYCLE, AND I SEE A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVING PROBLEMS WITH THAT OUT THERE. 
          SO I IF YOU LIKE THIS IDEA. I WANT TO PUT THIS SIGN UP ON THE JORDAN RIVER TRAIL AND SEE
HOW IT WORKS. 
          AND IT WORKS WELL. EXPAND IT TO OTHER TRAILS I HAVE. 
          I CAN'T SEE WHAT IT SAYS. CAN YOU READ IT TO ME? HOLD IT UP TO THE CAMERA, IT SAYS. YEAH. SPEED LIMIT TEN MILES AN HOUR WHEN PEDESTRIANS
PRESENT. 
          BUT I THINK ON RESIDENTIAL SIDEWALKS WE SHOULD. 
          IF WE DON'T HAVE A CODE ALREADY, WE SHOULD HAVE A CODE THAT SAYS TEN MILES AN HOUR MAXIMUM
SPEED REGARDLESS. 
          I DON'T CARE WHAT IT IS. IF SOMEONE RUNS 15 MILES AN HOUR ON A SIDEWALK AND SOMEONE'S KID
IS THERE PRACTICING WHATEVER IT IS AND, YOU KNOW, OR MAYBE YOU COULD HAVE A DIFFERENT IDEA,
WHAT, TEN MILES AN HOUR ON ALL SIDEWALKS ACROSS THE BOARD THAT ARE IN RESIDENTIAL AREAS PROBABLY DOESN'T MATTER IF IT'S RESIDENTIAL,
THOUGH. 
          ANY SIDEWALK. WHAT STATE CODE FOR PEDESTRIANS ARE PRESENT ON ANY SIDEWALK? YOU SHOULDN'T. RIGHT? ON RESIDENTIAL SIDEWALKS I WANT THE PEDESTRIANS AREN'T PRESENT. 
          IT'S LIMITED TO WHAT? STATE CODE ON NON HUMAN POWERED VEHICLES ON SIDEWALKS. THE STATE CODE FOR THE SCOOTERS IS 50MPH. 
          THEY CAN'T GO. IT CAN'T GO FASTER THAN THAT. BUT CITIES ARE ALLOWED TO TIGHTEN THAT UP. 
          SALT LAKE, BAN SCOOTERS ON SIDEWALKS. THEY DID,
AND THEY DIDN'T. 
          BECAUSE I KNOW THERE WAS AN ISSUE WHERE, NUMBER ONE,
THEY WERE GOING FAST ON SIDEWALKS AND CAUSING PROBLEMS. AND NUMBER TWO, SOMEONE I DON'T KNOW IF THEY GOT KILLED OR THEY GOT HURT FROM A UNEVEN
SIDEWALK. 
          WELL, I'LL SAY ONE THING. AND THIS IS JUST COMES DOWN TO EDUCATION MORE THAN ANYTHING,
BUT I, I LEAVE MY NEIGHBORHOOD ON I TURN I OFTEN TURN RIGHT ONTO 4800 WEST FROM DOORLY DRIVE. 
          AND WHEN I'M TURNING RIGHT, I LOOK TO THE LEFT TO LOOK FOR ONCOMING CARS. 
          AND YOU DON'T LOOK FOR THE RIGHT AND THEY'RE COMING AT YOU. 
          I'VE GOT I'VE JUST ABOUT HIT ON TWO DIFFERENT OCCASIONS. 
          I'VE JUST ABOUT HIT KIDS ON WHO HAVE BEEN ON THE SIDEWALK TRAVELING SOUTHBOUND ON THE LEFT HAND SIDE OF THE ROAD INSTEAD OF ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE ROAD. 
          AND IT DOESN'T MATTER THAT IT WAS A BICYCLE ONE TIME AND A BICYCLE THE OTHER TIME,
BUT THEY'RE BOTH BOTH OF THEM NOT FOLLOWING THE LAWS OF THE ROAD, AND AND IT'S JUST IT'S JUST DANGEROUS. AND I THINK I THINK WE NEED TO ADDRESS IT,
BUT BUT I THINK IT IT SEEMS LIKE A LOT OF WHAT WE NEED TO DO AS PUBLIC EDUCATION. 
          SO MAYBE WE NEED TO ASK THE MAYOR TO HAVE ADAM. 
          HANG ON. I THINK WE NEED TO ASK YOU TO HAVE ADAM WORK WITH LEGISLATURE,
BECAUSE THIS ISN'T JUST A WEST JORDAN PROBLEM. 
          [02:15:06]
I THINK WE NEED A PUBLIC EDUCATION PUSH AND IT NEEDS TO BE STATEWIDE. 
          SO IT NEEDS TO COME FROM THE LEGISLATURE. SO ZERO FATALITIES. 
          I MEAN, IT'S JUST I THINK HAVING ADAM WORK ON THAT TO GET THEM TO BE GOOD. 
          I THINK I HAVE SOMETHING OVER HERE AND THEN WE'LL GO TO YOU,
MR. ROBERTSON. 
          I THINK THERE IS A BIG PUBLIC EDUCATION PROBLEM. 
          THERE'S QUITE A FEW STATE CODES THAT ADDRESS E-BIKES AND E-SCOOTERS THAT ARE IN DIFFERENT
PLACES, AND THEY'RE HARD TO FIND. WE'RE PLANNING TO DO SOME STUFF ON OUR SOCIAL MEDIA. SOME OTHER AGENCIES HAVE DONE SOMETHING SIMILAR WHERE THEY JUST HIGHLIGHT THE STATE
CODES THAT ARE OUT THERE. 
          ONE OF THE AREAS I THINK THAT WE MAY CONSIDER SOME REGULATION IS ON THE MOTORCYCLES THAT
AREN'T STREET LEGAL AND WHERE IF THEY'RE GOING TO ALLOW THEM, I THINK SOUTH JORDAN'S EXAMPLE ON THAT OF REGULATING THOSE,
THOSE VEHICLES THAT ARE ALREADY REGULATED AND NOT ALLOWING THEM ON PUBLIC PROPERTY IS A GOOD START FOR US. AND THEN THE OTHER THING THAT I THINK NEEDS TO BE
REGULATED IS THE SPEED. 
          AND I THINK YOU DO THAT IN TWO WAYS WITH THE ACTUAL SPEED LIMIT. 
          TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, NO, PROBABLY NOT GOING TO HAVE GUYS THAT ARE CAN BARELY DO
TRAFFIC ENFORCEMENT. PROBABLY GOING TO HAVE GUYS WHO ARE SITTING WITH THE RADAR. THE OTHER OPTION THERE IS TO JUST PUT IN SOME LANGUAGE ABOUT THE MANNER IN WHICH THEY'RE DRIVING. 
          DO THEY NEED TO SHOW DUE REGARD? THEY NEED TO YIELD TO PEDESTRIANS AND THINGS LIKE THAT. 
          SO THERE'S A COUPLE OF OPTIONS THERE THAT ARE PUT IN ONE OF THE RADAR SPEED LIMIT SIGNS. 
          SO YOUR SPEED IS ON THE TRAIL. THAT THAT JUST MAKES YOU WANT TO GO FASTER THOUGH. 
          YEAH. LET'S SAY IT'S ONE OF THOSE ON THE GOLF COURSE. 
          AND WHENEVER I'M ON MY BIKE GOING PAST THERE,
I'M ALWAYS JUST TRYING TO SEE THE RESULT OF MOST PEOPLE. 
          SO I WANT TO I WANT TO WRAP UP SO THAT YOU'LL HAVE TIME BETWEEN TO REST OR DO WHATEVER YOU
DO BETWEEN SESSIONS. 
          IT SOUNDS LIKE WE AGREE EDUCATION NEEDS TO GO. 
          I DIDN'T HEAR ANYONE SAY THEY DIDN'T LIKE THE IDEA OF YOUR SIGN. 
          MAYOR. I THINK YOUR SIGN IS GREAT. FINE. I MEAN,
MOST OF THOSE DON'T HAVE SPEEDOMETERS ON THEM, RIGHT? BUT I THINK IT. I THINK IT DOESN'T. I THINK IT WOULD BE BETTER IF IT HAD AN ODD
NUMBER, LIKE NINE AND A HALF MILES, BECAUSE I THINK THOSE MAKE YOU THINK MORE SPEED LIMIT. 
          SEVEN AND A HALF MILES. YES, BECAUSE I JUST THINK IT MAKES YES,
IT CAN DO IT DOES THAT. 
          AND I JUST THINK THAT MAKES YOUR BRAIN THINK MORE. 
          I THINK THAT'S FINE. BUT I THINK I WOULD LIKE TO SEE DATA. 
          SO I'M WONDERING IF WE COULD START COLLECTING SOME DATA. 
          I'D LIKE TO SEE WHAT THE STATE LAWS ARE SO. WELL AND HE'S GOT THE STATE LAWS. 
          SO WHAT DO WE WHERE DO WE WANT TO GO FROM HERE? BASICALLY BECAUSE WE'RE NOT GOING TO WE'RE NOT GOING TO COME UP WITH ANYTHING TONIGHT. 
          SO HELP ME GIVE MR. ANDERSON DIRECTION OF WHERE WE WANT TO GO. 
          CAN I ASK ONE QUESTION, CHIEF? YOU SAID THERE'S ALL THESE SECTIONS OF STATE CODE THAT ARE. 
          YEAH, BECAUSE THE UTAH LEGISLATURE IS LEGISLATURES ARE NOTORIOUS FOR PUTTING THEM IN
DIFFERENT SPOTS. WE'VE BEEN PRETTY GOOD AT THAT TOO. YEAH. 
          SO WE HAVE TO WOULD WOULD WOULD IT BE BETTER FOR THE CITY TO DO SOMETHING LIKE SOUTH
JORDAN DOES? AND, AND, AND I HATE RECITING STATE CODE, BUT WOULD IT BE MORE BENEFICIAL TO THE RESIDENTS
AND TO THE POLICE DEPARTMENT IF WE PUT THAT IN THE CODE, ALL IN ONE SECTION,
SO THAT EVERYBODY KNOWS WHAT OUR WHAT WE EXPECT? I THINK THERE'S A PUBLIC EDUCATION PIECE THERE FOR SURE,
LONG TERM, THAT WE CAN JUST ALWAYS REFER SOMEBODY THERE. 
          WE DON'T HAVE TO CONTINUALLY SPREAD THAT MESSAGE,
BUT PARTICULARLY IF WE MAKE SMALL CHANGES, THEN IT MAKES SENSE TO ME TO JUST SEE THAT. AND,
YOU KNOW, LOOKING AT SOME OF THE OTHER CODES OUT THERE, PROVO'S CODE IS PRETTY EXTENSIVE AND HAS TO BE. 
          SO I WOULD AGREE WITH YOU THAT WE NEED TO WORK WITH THE PUBLIC EDUCATION PIECE AND THE
LEGISLATURE. 
          BUT GIVEN WHAT THE CHIEF JUST SAID. AND AND GIVEN IT SOUNDS LIKE PROVOST DUNN AT SOUTH
JORDAN'S DONE IT. 
          I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM CREATING A CODE THAT CONSOLIDATES IT ALL SO THAT IF THERE'S A
QUESTION, WE CAN SAY, GO TO THIS SECTION OF WEST JORDAN CODE AND IT MAKES IT EASIER FOR THE POLICE. 
          IT MAKES IT EASIER FOR EVERYBODY TO KNOW WHAT THE EXPECTATION IS IN WEST JORDAN. 
          SO WOULD WOULD THE BODY BE COMFORTABLE ASKING PD TO WORK WITH ATTORNEY'S OFFICE TO BRING
BACK A POTENTIAL CODE FOR US TO LOOK AT OR BE OKAY WITH THAT? MR. ANDERSON, I HAVE FOUR OR MORE. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. 
          AND I WILL CALL OUR WORK MEETING AND. AND I'LL SEE YOU AT SEVEN IN THE COUNCIL ROOM. 
          COUNCIL CHAMBERS. HEY, PAT. PATRICK.
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.