Apr 28, 2026 Committee of the Whole

[CALL TO ORDER]

[00:00:02]

KNOW, I KNOW YOU. ALL RIGHT, EVERYONE, WELCOME TO OUR WORK SESSION, OUR COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE WORK SESSION. THIS IS FOR APRIL 28TH, 2026, STARTING AT 5:00, A LITTLE LATER THAN NORMAL. BUT WE'RE EXCITED TO GET STARTED NONETHELESS. A FEW DISCUSSION TOPICS TO GO OVER

[a. Discussion of Rezone and Future Land Use Amendment for Property Located at Approximately 4622 West 7800 South]

MY NAME IS MARGARET HYATT. I AM ONE OF THE CO-OWNERS OF THAT PROPERTY AT 1700 SOUTH. AND AIRPORT ROAD IS HOW WE DESCRIBE IT CONSISTS OF THREE LOTS. ALSO HERE IN ATTENDANCE IS ALTA BANK REPRESENTATIVES OVER THERE, AND MY COLLEAGUE FROM ANOTHER HAT THAT I WEAR FROM MY DAY JOB, ROB SWEENEY. WE ARE SUPER EXCITED ABOUT ALTA BANK. THAT'S THEIR POTENTIAL SITE THERE ON THE CORNER. SO I KNOW ONE OF THE USES WE WANT. ONE OF THE THINGS WE WANT TO DISCUSS IS OUR RESPECTIVE USES. AND WE'RE HAPPY TO SAY WE. WE ARE UNDER CONTRACT WITH ALTA BANK AT THE CORNER. AND I THINK THEY'VE SUBMITTED SOME BEAUTIFUL ELEVATIONS OF WHAT IT WOULD LOOK LIKE. AND WE'RE JUST VERY EXCITED ABOUT THIS OPPORTUNITY. BUT WE ARE HERE TO REQUEST A REZONE AND AN AMENDMENT TO THE FUTURE LAND USE PLAN AMENDMENT. CURRENTLY, IT'S COMMERCIAL MANUFACTURED. AND THEN WE'D LIKE IT TO BECOME COMMERCIAL GENERAL. AND THEN ON THE FUTURE LAND USE. IT IS CURRENTLY RESEARCH PARK AND WE ARE ASKING FOR A COMMUNITY COMMERCIAL COMMUNITY GENERAL. HOW DO YOU SAY THAT? COMMERCIAL GENERAL. IT'S A DIFFERENT COMMUNITY COMMERCIAL. THERE WE GO. SORRY ABOUT THAT. THE THE IMPACTS I THINK ARE ARE NEGLIGIBLE, IF ANY. WE HAVE ALREADY. ALL THREE LOTS ARE WATER, SEWER STUFFED AND A BANK IS PROBABLY A LITTLE LESS INTRUSIVE THAN ALREADY PERMITTED DRIVE THROUGH. SO I THINK WE'RE ACTUALLY REDUCING OUR IMPACTS WITH THAT USE. THAT SAID, WE HOPE TO DO A TYPICAL RETAIL AND RESTAURANT, AS WELL AS DRIVE THROUGH ON THE BALANCE OF THE OTHER TWO LOTS. THERE'S AN AIRPORT NEXT TO IT. DID YOU KNOW THERE'S AN AIRPORT RIGHT NEXT TO IT? WE JUST ALWAYS JOKE BECAUSE PEOPLE OH, THERE IT IS.

WE'RE HAPPY ABOUT THE AIRPORT. SAME WITH STORM DRAINAGE, CURB GUTTER, SIDEWALKS ALREADY IN PLACE. PLENTY OF POWER FOR OUR INTENDED FUTURE USE. AND. I, I THINK THAT'S IT'S, YOU KNOW, WE WERE READY TO GO WITH ANYTHING LIKE THIS AND INCLUDING THE BANK. AND SO UNFORTUNATELY, THE BANK WAS NOT A PERMITTED USE WITHIN THE CURRENT ZONING. AND SO WE'RE REQUESTING A FORWARD WITH OUR APPLICATION. I'VE GOT IT IN MY CAR READY TO GO TOMORROW. EXCUSE ME, A GREEN LIGHT. WILL THE BANK TAKE ALL THREE LOTS. YEAH. THEY'LL TAKE JUST THE FIRST AND ACTUALLY PORTION OF THAT ONE. SO WE'RE GOING TO OUR PLAN RIGHT NOW IS TO REQUEST A MINOR SUBDIVISION AND CREATE FOUR LOTS OUT OF THAT SPACE. THIS LOT ON THE FAR LEFT HERE WILL REMAIN THE SAME.

AND THEN THAT LINE IS GOING TO GO OVER THERE. THE BANK NEEDS ONE ACRE. THIS IS ABOUT 1.5.

AND THEN WE WOULD CREATE TWO LOTS OUT OF THIS SPACE, TWO LOTS OUT OF THE MIDDLE SPACE OR TWO LOTS OUT OF LIKE THAT. THREE OUT OF TWO. YEAH, YEAH. OKAY. BASED ON MARKETABILITY, WE THINK THAT THAT HAS A BETTER VIABILITY FOR WHAT WE'RE SEEING IN THE MARKET. PEOPLE ARE WANTING SMALLER, NOT BIGGER. AND SO WE THINK WE'LL GET FROM A, FROM A MARKETING PERSPECTIVE, IF THAT WORKS OUT WELL, WHAT TYPE OF USES DO YOU THINK MIGHT OCCUPY THE OTHER. WE HAD ANOTHER A CREDIT UNION THAT WAS LOOKING AT IT, BUT I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE MORE A SHOP SPACE, RETAIL SHOP SPACE AND SOME DRIVE THROUGH LIKE WE COULD DO WE FIT IF YOU IF YOU HAVE THE CONCEPTUAL SITE PLAN, I'LL WORK ON THAT. OKAY. THEY DEFINITELY SHOW ON THIS LOT. WE WERE IN DISCUSSIONS WITH THE NATIONAL DRIVE THROUGH CHAIN AND HERE ON THIS ONE WE CAN DO FOR LIKE 15,

[00:05:04]

YES, YES, THIS IS. JUST A LITTLE A LITTLE SHOPPING CENTER. SHE'S GOT TWO. STILL MAKES VACANT DECADES. DIDN'T THEY JUST PUT IN A NEW QUICK LOOP? ONE. THERE WAS THREE. YEAH.

OKAY. YEAH. SO YEAH, THERE WAS THE I, I THINK JUST, YOU KNOW, I MENTIONED MY OTHER DAY JOB COMMERCIAL BROKER WITH LEGEND COMMERCIAL AND, AND THEN AT THE SAME TIME, I WEAR A HAT AS AN OWNER OF LAND AND THE COST OF CONSTRUCTION IS, IS JUST TOUGH. AND YOU, YOU HAVE, IT TAKES A LONG TIME TO FIND THE RIGHT PERSON OR GROUP OR BUSINESS OWNER THAT CAN AFFORD TO PAY THE RENT. YOU HAVE TO CHARGE. SO THERE'S, THERE'S JUST A LOT OF VACANT LAND, RIGHT? ONE ON THE EAST SIDE OF AUTOZONE, AND THEN THE ONE BETWEEN THE QUICK LUBE AND AUTOZONE ACROSS FROM THE SUBWAY. YEAH. CONSTRUCTION, OF COURSE, IS HIGH NOW AND HAS BEEN FOR SOME. YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE THAT SAME ISSUE. SO THE REASON I BRING IT UP IS BECAUSE THIS CONCEPT PLAN LOOKS LIKE

[00:10:02]

IS THIS ROAD. AIRPORT ROAD IS VERY BUSY, A LIGHTED INTERSECTION. I THINK OUR I LIKE OUR PROPERTY A LITTLE BETTER. THAT PERSPECTIVE. AND. AND AGAIN, I KEEP MENTIONING DELTA BANK. DO I GET A KICKBACK FOR KEEP FISHING RIGHT. THERE. THEY'RE GOING TO BE ANOTHER REASON TO STOP AND LOOK. AND I, I THINK WE'RE A BETTER SITE FOR THAT REASON. I THINK WE'LL DRAW SOME, SOME ATTENTION. YEAH. AND I, I DON'T THINK THAT MY PERSONAL OPINION SHOULDN'T STAND IN THE WAY OF THE CITY ALLOWING YOU TO TAKE THE RISK. RIGHT? I MEAN, IF YOU CAN'T BUILD IT AND YOU CAN'T BUILD IT, THAT'S NOT ON US. AND I WAS GOING TO SAY THAT EXACT SAME THING. LIKE THAT'S THEIR RESPONSIBILITY TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT IT'S PROFITABLE, RIGHT? YEAH. AND OBVIOUSLY HOLDING IT IN THE ZONE FOR THE LAST SEVERAL DECADES HASN'T.

EXACTLY SPURRED INTEREST IN THE PROPERTY. HAVE YOU THOUGHT ABOUT FUTURE EXPANSION OF 7800 SOUTH? IT'S EXPANDABLE WIDTH WISE. LIKE HOW HOW WOULD YOU DEAL WITH THAT? WOULD IT IMPACT YOUR PARKING? MAYBE IT'S NOT IN THE PLAN. I DON'T KNOW. I KNOW YOU'VE GOT A BIG DRAINAGE THERE.

WE COLLECTIVELY THE ROYAL DRAINAGE. SO IF YOU UNDERGROUNDING THAT DRAINAGE MAYBE THAT WOULD ADDRESS THAT POTENTIALLY. I MEAN IT'S WITHIN. I FORGOT THE SETBACK.

REQUIREMENTS. BUT MAYBE JUST UNDERGROUNDING THAT DRAINAGE. BUT TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, NO I HAVEN'T THAT IMPACT. BUT WE WE DID IMPOSE ON ALPHA BANK A VIEW CORRIDOR. SO WE PUSHED THEIR BUILDING BACK ON THE SITE PLAN. PRETTY FAR BACK. SO THAT. THAT'S RIGHT. SO THAT BACK HERE THAT'S THEIR BUILDING EDGE. SO YEAH, I GUESS WE WOULD POTENTIALLY LOSE PARKING HERE IF THERE WAS A TAKING. BUT AT LEAST THE BUILDING THERE MAY NEVER BE. I DON'T I DON'T KNOW.

YEAH. THAT DRAINAGE IS THERE NOW OR ARE YOU JUST GOING TO BUILD AROUND IT. BUILD AROUND IT. I THINK IT'S IT'S THAT SEEMS TO SHOW A SIDEWALK. THE SIDEWALK IS THERE NOW THERE'S A SIDEWALK AND THEN THERE'S THE DRAINAGE AND IT'S EARTHEN RIGHT NOW. YEAH, IT'S A CONCEPT PLAN.

IT'S NOT AN ENGINEERING DRAWING. SHOWING. IT DOESN'T SEEM TO BE ENOUGH ROOM FOR THE DRAINAGE BETWEEN THE SIDEWALK AND THE PARKING PLACES THERE. BUT. YOU UNDERSTAND, IS ONCE WE CHANGE THE ZONE FOR THOSE THREE BUILDINGS, IT'S GOING TO COME BACK. THAT'S WHAT THE PEOPLE.

MUCH SMARTER THAN ME. I THINK IT'S. NOT WHAT'S GOING TO BE HERE. ANY QUESTIONS WE HAVE REGARDING THIS SITE, THIS POSSIBLE CHANGE. VERY OPTIMISTIC ON THE CARS AND DRIVE THROUGH. I LIKE THE LAZY RIVER EFFECT. DEFINITELY. THERE'LL BE 20. YEAH. SO I HAVE TO GIVE CREDIT. MY MY BROTHER IS A CIVIL ENGINEER AND HE DID A VAST MAJORITY OF JORDAN LANDING. SO SO HE DOES MAGIC ON. MY FAMILY WAS INVOLVED THIS PROJECT MANY YEARS. THAT'S AWESOME. SO ON THIS DO WE HAVE DO WE HAVE ANY REAL OPPOSITION? WE HAVE FOUR WHO ARE READY TO SEE THIS MOVE FORWARD. I THINK WE ARE ALL SET THERE. UNLESS RAY WANTS TO COME UP WITH SOME REASON WHY WE SHOULD. NO, I JUST THINK THIS IS A GOOD SITE. YEAH. SERVICES IN THAT AREA, THE RESIDENTIAL AREAS THERE'S. THERE IS. I THINK IT'S A NICE TRANSITION FROM THE HEAVIER.

IT'S. YOU'RE RIGHT. EVERYBODY GETS A FREE UMBRELLA. HOW ABOUT A FREE BALLOONS FROM THE OLD

[00:15:12]

ALREADY GOT ONE ONE IN PLACE AND POSSIBLY ANOTHER. AND THEN YOU JUST FILL UP THE REST. ZACH WILL SLEEP EASIER. ALL RIGHT. WELL THANK YOU. WE WILL JUST MOVE ON THEN TO OUR ITEM TWO B.

[b. Presentation on Jordan Valley Water Conservation District Water Availability Report and West Jordan Drought Management Plan]

WE'VE GOT OUR VERY OWN GREG DAVENPORT HERE TO PRESENT. GREAT. WHAT ARE YOU DOING? I DON'T THINK IT'S ANY SECRET THAT OUR THE WASATCH FRONT HAS HAD A RECORD LOW SNOWFALL TOTALS FOR THIS YEAR. AS A RESULT OF THAT SNOWPACK. JORDAN VALLEY WATER CONSERVANCY DISTRICT BOARD MET ON APRIL 8TH AND DISCUSSED AND DECIDED ON WHAT WOULD BE AN APPROPRIATE DROUGHT MANAGEMENT LEVEL FOR WATER AVAILABILITY LEVEL FOR ALL OF ITS WHOLESALE CUSTOMERS.

THEY DECIDED TO GO TO A LEVEL TWO DROUGHT. WHAT THAT MEANS FOR THE CITY OF WEST JORDAN IS THAT THEY WOULD LIKE US TO CONSERVE 10% OF THE WATER THAT WE NORMALLY WOULD PURCHASE FROM THEM. ANYTHING OVER THAT, THE 10% REDUCTION, WE COULD BE ASKED TO PAY A HIGHER SURCHARGE ON ANY WATER. SO IT WOULD MEAN THAT THEY WOULD PROVIDE US WATER, BUT IT WOULD MEAN THAT THERE WOULD BE A HIGHER COST FOR THAT WATER. IF I HAD TO SPEAK FOR THE BOARD, I WOULD SAY THEY DID IT NOT BECAUSE THIS YEAR THEY'RE WORRIED ABOUT WATER SUPPLIES, BUT IT'S BECAUSE THEY'RE WORRIED ABOUT SUPPLIES FOR NEXT YEAR. ANYTHING THAT WE CAN SAVE IN THE RESERVOIRS THIS YEAR MEANS THAT WE'LL BE BETTER PROTECTED NEXT YEAR. AND I THINK WHAT THEY WERE ALSO TRYING TO DO WAS IT MAY BE A STAGE TWO THIS YEAR IF WE DID NOTHING AND WE HAD ANOTHER YEAR LIKE WE HAD THIS YEAR, THEY MAY COME INTO YOU, BE COMING TO YOU WITH A STAGE FOUR DROUGHT AND THEN A STAGE FOUR, FOUR LEVEL DROUGHT. NO WATERS FOR RESIDENTIAL, RIGHT? SO REALLY, I THINK IT WAS A GOOD DECISION ON THE BOARD'S PART. WHEN JORDAN VALLEY WATER CONSERVANCY DISTRICT DECLARED A DROUGHT LEVEL, THAT IS AN ACTIONABLE, ACTIONABLE THRESHOLD FOR THE MAYOR AND ALSO FOR CITY COUNCIL TO LOOK AT THEIR OWN DROUGHT RESPONSE AND WHAT THEY WERE GOING TO REQUIRE OF THEIR RESIDENTS, AND ASKING YOU TO CONSIDER THE SAME DROUGHT LEVEL THAT JORDAN VALLEY WATER CONSIDERED A LEVEL TWO DROUGHT. LET ME EXPLAIN JUST FOR A SECOND WHAT THAT WOULD MEAN FOR A RESIDENTIAL CUSTOMER IN THE WESTERN AREA.

WE WOULD BE ASKING THEM TO CONSERVE 10%. THERE ARE A LOT OF WAYS THAT SOMEBODY COULD CONSERVE 10%. THE FIRST THING THEY COULD DO IS THEY COULD PUT OFF WATERING UNTIL MAY 15TH.

THEY COULD END WATERING IN SEPTEMBER 15TH OF YEAR. THIS YEAR, THAT'S WHAT JORDAN VALLEY IS ASKING THEIR CUSTOMERS, RESIDENTIAL, RETAIL CUSTOMERS, TO DO. THE SECOND THING THEY COULD DO IS THEY COULD WATER ONE DAY A WEEK LESS THAN THEY NORMALLY DO. SO LET'S SAY IN THE SUMMERTIME, YOU WATER FOUR DAYS A WEEK AND YOU DECIDE, WELL, INSTEAD OF A REALLY GREEN LAWN, I WOULD LIKE A YELLOW LAWN OR A YELLOW GREEN LAWN. I'M GOING TO WATER THREE TIMES A WEEK INSTEAD OF FOUR TIMES A WEEK. AND MY LAWN WILL STILL BE HEALTHY AND IT'LL STILL GROW.

IT JUST WON'T BE THE SAME COLOR. AS WELL, RIGHT? OR IF YOU'RE LIKE ME, YOU JUST LEAVE IT REALLY HIGH ANYWAY. AND WHEN THE ROOTS ARE ARE COVERED FROM THE SUN, THEN YOU DON'T NEED AS MUCH WATER. BUT THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE ASKING. IT'S, IT'S NOT A REALLY DIFFICULT GOAL FOR THE CITIZENS. WE HAD A SIMILAR PROBLEM WITH THE WATER THAT WAS IN THE RESERVOIRS BACK IN 2021 AND 2022, AND OUR CITIZENS, WE HAVE A 10%, BUT THERE WAS NO FORCE. IT WAS JUST PLEASE CONSERVE. AND PEOPLE DID IT ON THEIR OWN. THERE WAS NO WHAT STORIES MAKE ME STOP WATERING THE LAWN? CORRECT. WE DID HAVE SOME PEOPLE CALL US AND SAY, MY WATER, MY NEIGHBOR'S WATERING TOO MUCH. AND WE HAD TO SAY, GOOD, THAT'S OKAY, BUT WE THANK YOU FOR SAVING, RIGHT? SO WE DIDN'T REQUIRE ANYBODY. NOW, A STAGE TWO LEVEL DROUGHT, THERE IS A MANDATORY REDUCTION. AND THOSE ARE FOR PEOPLE LIKE CITY GOVERNMENT. THAT IS FOR PEOPLE LIKE SCHOOLS AND GOLF COURSES.

NOW I WANT TO CONSIDER HAVE YOU CONSIDERED TWO SOURCES HERE? THE LEVEL TWO DROUGHT? I'M REALLY APPLYING TO THE CULINARY WATER SOURCES. THOSE ARE THE SOURCES THAT ARE PURIFIED AND

[00:20:01]

CHARGING THEM. OH YEAH. EVERYONE TAP OFF. THAT WOULD BE LOGISTICALLY VERY DIFFICULT TO MONITOR EVERYBODY'S USAGE. NO MORE SHOWERS FOR YOU. THE WAY IT WORKS FROM JORDAN VALLEY TO THE CITY IS NORMALLY, AS YOU KNOW, WE CONTRACT TO BUY A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF WATER. WE PAY FOR THAT AMOUNT OF WATER, WHETHER IT BE THAT'S 100% LEVEL, RIGHT? SO THAT'S SOMETHING AROUND 20,000 ACRE FEET A YEAR. I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE EXACT NUMBER IS. OUR CONTRACT FOR 100% IS AROUND 20,000. YEAH, YEAH. PLUS OR MINUS A FEW. JORDAN VALLEY THEN ALLOWS YOU TO PURCHASE IN A NORMAL YEAR, UP TO 20% MORE. SO IF IT'S DRY, YOU NEED TO USE MORE. YOU CAN BUY UP TO 20% MORE AT THE SAME RATE. AND THEN AFTER THAT, 120% MARK IN YOUR IN WHAT'S CALLED TIER TWO RATES. AND IT'S RIDICULOUSLY MORE EXPENSIVE. AND THAT'S, THAT'S OUR BUYING WATER FROM JORDAN THIS YEAR INSTEAD OF GETTING 20% EXTRA BECAUSE OF THE STAGE TWO DROUGHT, WE GET 10% EXTRA UP TO 20. WE GET TEN. TIER TWO DOESN'T MOVE DOWN TO 110. IT'S JUST THERE'S AN ADDITIONAL PENALTY THAT WE WOULDN'T NORMALLY HAVE BETWEEN 110 120.

SO THAT'S THAT'S WHY WE'RE BEING ASKED TO TELL OUR CUSTOMERS TO CONSERVE SO THAT WE DON'T END UP PAYING MORE FOR WATER. AND WE HAVE TO ADJUST RATES BECAUSE NOW WE'RE DIPPING

[00:25:01]

AND AGAIN. BUT THAT'S WHEN NOBODY I THINK EVERYONE SEES THE SNOW NOT THERE IN THE MOUNTAINS. SO I REALLY DO BELIEVE THAT ONCE YOU DO THIS AND ONCE WE PUBLICIZE THIS, THERE WILL BE PEOPLE OUT. RIGHT BEFORE I HEARD THAT'S WHAT I WAS GOING TO ASK IS WHAT KIND OF OUTREACH HAS THERE BEEN ALREADY? LIKE, WHAT DO THEY WHAT DOES JORDAN VALLEY DO? SO JORDAN VALLEY HAS A LITTLE BIT MORE MONEY THAN WE DO. SO WE'VE KIND OF LET THEM GO THE WAY.

AND THEY'RE, THEY'RE GOING TO GO AND ADVERTISE ON TV, ON RADIO AND ON SOCIAL MEDIA. AND THEIR MESSAGE IS USE 10% LESS OR NO, THEIR MESSAGE IS, YOU WANT TO HELP US WITH THAT MESSAGE. IT IS DON'T WATER TILL MAY 15TH. STOP AT SEPTEMBER 17TH AND. LIKE ONE DAY WITH WATER. YES. YEAH. AND THE THING IS WATER WAS IT? THIS YEAR IS DIFFERENT AND LIFE IS BETTER WITH WATER. LIFE IS BETTER WITH WATER, RIGHT? NOT WHAT I WOULD HAVE CHOSEN. AND IF WE'RE LIKE OTHER CITIES AND WHAT THEY'RE DOING, AND THEN THAT SALT LAKE CITY IS IN A DROUGHT TO LEVEL.

WEAVER BASIN IS AT A 20%, NOT JUST TEN. JORDAN VALLEY'S TARGET WITH WITH LEVEL TWO IS 10 TO 20%. OKAY. TEN IS THE IS THE MINIMUM THAT WE WANT TO. SO I DIDN'T REALIZE THAT THE CITY HAD TO ADOPT THIS JUST PROCEDURALLY. WHAT HAPPENS IF WE DON'T. THEN WE LET OUR CUSTOMERS USE ALL THE WATER THEY WANT LIKE THAT. AND. THERE ARE TWO. THERE ARE TWO STRATEGIES, STRATEGIES THAT I HAVE JUST, YOU KNOW, EVERY. YEAH. STRATEGIES. EVERY MONTH I GET, I GET UPDATED INFORMATION FROM JORDAN VALLEY ABOUT THE STATUS OF OUR CONTRACT AND HOW MUCH BEFORE THIS ALL CAME OUT. WE WERE UBER DID LAST YEAR, WHICH IS NOT A GOOD THING BECAUSE WE WERE AT 110% I. SO I LOOK AT THAT EVERY MONTH. WE HAVE OUR OWN SUPPLIES. WE'RE VERY LUCKY. CITY IN SOUTH JORDAN. THEY RELY STRICTLY ON WHAT JORDAN VALLEY IS. SO WE DO HAVE WELLS THAT WE CAN USE. I CAN DECIDE WHEN THEY START. I CAN DECIDE WHEN THEY STOP. I IF I REALLY NEEDED TO IN A BAD YEAR, I COULD TAKE PROBABLY 4000 ACRE FEET OUT OF OUR GROUNDWATER. LAST YEAR I TOOK OUT A 9.2000 ACRE FEET, SO I CAN ALWAYS USE THAT IF I REALLY NEED TO. I DON'T REALLY WANT TO. I REALLY THINK THAT OUR RESIDENTS ARE GOING TO ARE GOING TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE. AND LET ME EXPLAIN WHY. LAST YEAR, WHEN THERE WAS NO MESSAGING, HOW PEOPLE WERE WAY OVER LIKE WE WERE ABOUT. 120% OF CONTRACT FOR THE YEAR, ALL OF A SUDDEN THE GOVERNMENT CAME OUT, CAME OUT AND SAID, YEAH, YOU KNOW, THERE'S NOT THAT MUCH WATER.

PLEASE START CONSERVING. ALL OF A SUDDEN, WESTWARD USERS, THEY WENT FROM BEING 120% OVER TO UNDER. RIGHT. AND THEN BY THE END OF THE YEAR, WE GOT DOWN TO 110, RIGHT? SO WE ACTUALLY SAVED 10% FROM JULY TO DECEMBER. SO. RIGHT. AND SO, AND THE HOTTEST MONTH THAT YEAR WAS ACTUALLY JUNE. SO WE'D ALREADY GONE THROUGH THAT RIGHT NOW. MAYBE IT WAS BECAUSE THEY ALSO SAW THEIR BILLS AND SAID, WELL, I DON'T WANT TO PAY THAT. BUT THERE COULD HAVE BEEN A LOT OF REASONS. BUT, BUT WHEN RESIDENTS SEE, OR ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY THINK, OH, I NEED TO DO A BETTER JOB, THEY HAVE RESPONDED TO THAT. SO I REALLY THINK YOU'RE GOING TO SEE I'M HOPEFUL THAT YOU'RE GOING TO SEE A DIFFERENCE. I DON'T KNOW FOR SURE BY THE END OF MAY, WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN AND WHETHER THE RESIDENTS ARE RESPONDING OR NOT. AND I WILL ADJUST OUR WELLS AS MUCH AS I CAN FOR SAFETY. YOU'RE NOT WORRIED ABOUT PULLING ANYTHING? WELL, THE BECAUSE I'VE BEEN PULLING OUT LAST FOR A LONG TIME. THE THE THE CONTAMINATED AREA IS IS INCHING FARTHER AND FARTHER AWAY FROM WEST JORDAN. ONE YEAR IS NOT. MORE THAN I HAVE A QUESTION. LOGISTICALLY, IT SEEMS TO ME LIKE THE VALUE IS IN THE MESSAGING. AND OF COURSE THE RATES. BUT THE RATES IS AFTER THE FACT. IS THERE REALLY ANY VALUE IN ADOPTING THIS AS A CITY? BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE ENCOURAGED TO CONSERVE REGARDLESS. I THINK THIS IS PART OF THE MESSAGE THOUGH. SO YOU ADOPTING THIS REALLY DOES SAY THIS IS IMPORTANT TO US. THIS IS WHY WE HAVE THIS. AND IT ALSO ALLOWS GREG TO THEN CALL THE SCHOOL

[00:30:02]

SO NORMALLY WE DON'T HAVE THE TOPIC AT COMMITTEE LEVEL FOR SOMETHING THAT'S COMING UP ON THE MEETING. BUT THIS IS KIND OF TIME SENSITIVE. SO WHAT GREG AND THE COUNCIL DISCUSSED WITH LEADERSHIP IS HAVING A DISCUSSION AT THIS POINT FOR THE COUNCIL TO ASK QUESTIONS ABOUT ENTERING THIS WATER. WHAT DO YOU CALL IT? WATER SHORTAGE RESPONSE. FOLLOWING OUR WHAT THE COUNCIL HAS ALREADY ADOPTED WITH THE DROUGHT MANAGEMENT PLAN, AND LATER TONIGHT IN THE REGULAR MEETING, THERE WILL BE A BUSINESS ITEM TO ADOPT A JOINT RESOLUTION WITH THE SEVEN OF YOU AND THE MAYOR TO ADOPT THIS RESPONSE. AND THAT DOES GIVE GREG AND OTHERS AN ABILITY TO HELP EDUCATE AND MARIE, TO HELP EDUCATE THE RESIDENTS THAT ARE. GOT IT. THANK YOU. THANKS, MARIE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. WE HAVE OUR. FORWARD TO THIS AHEAD TO TONIGHT. IT'S ALREADY THERE.

YEAH I KNOW. YEAH. ALL RIGHT. WELL THEN WE'RE GOING TO MOVE ON TO ITEM TWO. C DISCUSSION OF

[c. Discussion of Proposed West Jordan Anti-Idling Ordinance]

OKAY. A LOT OF US HAVE LAPTOPS OPEN RIGHT NOW. RIGHT? GOOD POINT, GOOD POINT BECAUSE I COULD SEARCH GOOGLE. ANYWAY, SO I STARTED SEARCHING AND FOUND OUT THAT FOR MOST CITIES THAT HAVE THIS, THEY'VE ADOPTED A TWO MINUTE IDLING STANDARD. YOU HAVE TWO MINUTES, YOU HAVE YOUR CAR. OBVIOUSLY, I DON'T THINK ANY OF THEM HAVE POLICE OFFICERS SITTING THERE WITH STOPWATCHES AND 121 SECONDS. THEY'RE WRITING UP TICKETS. BUT IT'S NOT THAT DIFFERENT TO ME TO DO WATER DISCUSSION. JUST IT'S A IT'S A MESSAGE THING. SAYING THIS MATTERS IN OUR CITY.

I'M GOING TO PUT THIS IN PLACE AND ENCOURAGE PEOPLE NOT TO IDLE. I THINK IF ALL YOU DO IS ENCOURAGE AND YOU DON'T HAVE ANY TEETH BEHIND IT, IT LOSES. IT LOSES ANY EFFICACY AT ALL.

[00:35:08]

BUT THAT'S, THAT'S HARDER TO THAT'S HARDER TO MEASURE. IT HAS BEEN MEASURED. STUDIES HAVE BEEN DONE AND SHOWING IN THOSE CITIES 38%. SO YOU CAN GIVE US THOSE STUDIES AS WELL. YEAH. I MEAN, I SAW THE I TRIED TO ATTACH A BUNCH OF STUFF TO THE RCA AND I DON'T KNOW, OKAY. I'M JUST WONDERING, SALT LAKE COUNTY ACTUALLY DOES. YEAH. SO YEAH, SHE WENT FROM 2008. I THOUGHT THEY WERE 28, 2008, SALT LAKE COUNTY, SALT LAKE COUNTY COUNTYWIDE POLICY VEHICLE ENGINE. RIGHT. SO HERE'S A QUESTION FOR CHIEF. DO YOU ENFORCE COUNTY ORDINANCES? NO. SO IT'S THIS THE COUNTY ORDINANCE IS USELESS TO YOU. YEAH. AND BEING A POLICY IS PROBABLY FOR THEIR INTERNAL. THEIR LIKE COMPANY CARS. OH I DIDN'T REALIZE THAT. I DIDN'T REALIZE THAT THE CITY POLICE WOULD ENFORCE COUNTY OWNED VEHICLES AND ALSO COUNTY OWNED VEHICLES AND THEIR CONTRACTORS. SOUTH JORDAN, INTERESTINGLY PASSED A RESOLUTION SAYING PLEASE DON'T DO THIS, BUT DIDN'T PUT ANY ENFORCEMENT I DON'T KNOW ABOUT. SO LET ME JUST PUT IT THIS. I'M JUST NOT TRYING TO. TRYING TO SOUND ANTI ANYTHING HERE, BUT THIS BILL KIND OF ORDINANCE TO ME ALWAYS SOUNDS LIKE A PICK UP YOUR DOG POOP ORDINANCE. EVERYONE SHOULD DO IT. BUT THAT ONE'S ACTUALLY ON THE BOOKS. BUT BUT I'M JUST SAYING IT'S IT'S JUST, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THOSE THINGS EVERYONE SHOULD BE DOING THIS, BUT IF YOU'RE, THERE'S NO REAL STOPPING OR THINGS. AND MY WORRY, HERE'S WHERE I WORRY. THIS IS WHERE WE'D HAVE TO WRITE IT. MY WORRY IS SUDDENLY BECOMES A THING WHERE NEIGHBORS ARE NOW CALLING OUT OTHER, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE CALLING OUT CODE ENFORCEMENT OR WHATEVER, OR OUR POLICE ON NEIGHBORS IDLING IN THEIR DRIVEWAY. AND I THINK IT'S JUST THERE'S A WATER USAGE. YEAH, IT'S, IT'S SO IT'S THE CAN OF WORMS THERE THAT I'M JUST WONDERING HOW WE, HOW WE MAKE IT. SO IT'S NOT THAT ADMITTEDLY, THAT IS ANOTHER IMPETUS BEHIND THIS, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE. REMOTE STARTS. I TELL YOU, REMOTE STARTING. YEAH. AND IT'S REALLY I'VE, I'VE NEVER LET MY CAR IDLE. SO I JUST DON'T THINK ABOUT THAT AS A THING. BUT. I, I, THAT'S ALL I'M WONDERING, BUT I JUST DON'T WANT IT TO SUDDENLY BECOME A THING WHERE NOW WE'RE HAVING NEIGHBORS USING THIS TO HELP THEIR, YOU KNOW, THEIR PETTY ARGUMENTS THAT THEY HAVE ON SOMETHING ELSE. AND THIS JUST BECOMES SOMETHING THAT CAN ADD IN. WE CAN KEEP IT OUT THEN I'M FINE.

I MEAN, ANY, ANYTHING THAT STOPS PEOPLE FROM IDLING OR LETTING THEIR DOGS POOP IN YARDS OR GOOD, GOOD THINGS. BUT ONE THING I'M CONCERNED ABOUT IS THE POLICE OFTEN HAVE TO LEAVE THEIR VEHICLES IDLING FOR GOOD REASON. AND YES, IN AREAS. AND THERE IS AN EXCEPTION IN THERE. THE THE CONCERN I HAVE, THOUGH, IS A POLICE OFFICER WHO KNOWS THAT HIS VEHICLE IS IDLING FOR HIS WHOLE 12 HOUR SHIFT OR WHATEVER HE'S ON. IS THAT POLICE OFFICER? GOING TO EVEN FEEL THE ABILITY IN THEIR MIND TO THEN GO OUT AND PURSUE SOMEONE WHO IS IDLING THEIR VEHICLE WITHOUT GOOD REASON, BECAUSE THAT OFFICER KNOWS, HEY, MY TRUCK'S SITTING OVER THERE AND IT'S IDLING FOR MY WHOLE SHIFT. BUT EVEN THOUGH HE HAS A GOOD REASON OR SHE ONLY. WE HAD AN OFFICER THAT WOULD SPEAK TO THAT. WELL, I CAN'T SPEAK FOR EVERYBODY, BUT I THINK THAT OUR OFFICERS WILL ENFORCE WHAT THEY CAN BECAUSE IT'S THE CODE. AND I THINK IF THERE'S AN EXCEPTION IN THERE, THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE CAN EXPLAIN. THERE'S SOME LAWS THAT CERTAIN OFFICERS MAY NOT FEEL STRONGLY ABOUT, BUT WE'RE STILL EXPECTED TO ENFORCE THOSE LAWS THE WAY THEY'RE WRITTEN. MY CONCERN WITH THIS IS REALLY HAVING THE STAFF AND THE TIME. SO A LITTLE BIT TO YOUR POINT, IF YOU CALL YOUR NEIGHBORS IDLING, CHANCES ARE IF IT'S A BUSY TIME, WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET TO THAT CALL FOR AN HOUR AND WE'RE NOT GOING TO MAKE IT THERE. AND WE'RE INVESTE

[00:40:03]

AND SO THEN WHEN THEY DON'T SHOW UP, IT GIVES THEM A BAD MARK. AND I DON'T I DON'T WANT TO ADD ANOTHER LAYER THAT DOES THAT, ESPECIALLY WHEN I DON'T FEEL THAT WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED WILL MAKE MUCH OF A DIFFERENCE, LIKE IN SCHOOL ZONES. WELL, THAT'S UP TO THE SCHOOLS. SO WE'RE NOT GOING TO PUT SIGNAGE ON THEIR PROPERTY. SCHOOLS ARE, AND I THINK THE SCHOOLS ARE ALREADY GIVEN THE EDUCATION. RIGHT. AND MANY OF THEM ALREADY CHOOSE TO DO THAT. THE PRINCIPAL CAN CHOOSE TO HAVE THAT SIGNAGE PUT UP. SO PRINCIPAL CAN CHOOSE TO HAVE NO IDLING SIGNAGE. ARE THERE ANY SCHOOLS IN WESTERN THAT HAVE THAT SITUATION? I'D LIKE TO SPEAK TO JUST MY ANECDOTAL EXPERIENCE WITH THE ANTI IDLING. THEY HAVE BEEN 15, MAYBE EVEN 20 YEARS AGO. THERE WAS A BIG PUSH HERE IN SALT LAKE OF ANTI IDLING. THERE WAS THIS ROUND STICKER AND IDLE. YEAH IDLE FREE ZONE. AND AND YOU'D SEE THEM IN THE THE THE WINDOW AT THE BANK AND IT WAS LIKE A AND I, I CONSCIOUSLY. REDUCED MY IDLING THROUGH THAT CAMPAIGN.

SO. IF WE TO YOUR POINT, MAYBE IF IT WAS MORE OF AN INFORMATIONAL CAMPAIGN WITHOUT THE ENFORCEMENT, MAYBE THAT WOULD MAYBE IT'D BE BETTER. LIKE I KNOW FOR ME IT WORKED.

YEAH, BUT I DON'T, I DON'T, I DON'T DISAGREE WITH YOUR, YOUR EFFORTS. RIGHT, RIGHT. SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT AN EDUCATIONAL EFFORT NOT BE AN ORDINANCE, LIKE MAYBE A RESOLUTION OR SOMETHING THAT'S LIKE WHAT SOUTH JORDAN DID, RIGHT? IS THERE SOMETHING THAT WOULD UNLOCK EXTRA EDUCATION EFFORT? WE ALL TAKE A HANDFUL OF STICKERS OUT OF OUR BUDGET TO SAY, GIVING YOU X AMOUNT OF MONEY. WE WANT AN ANTI-PIPELINE CAMPAIGN IN OUR CITY. IS IT AN ISSUE? I THINK IT IS. YES, PEOPLE ARE IDLING, BUT I FOR THE LIFE OF ME, I CAN'T THINK OF ONE TIME I'VE HEARD IN THE CITY WHERE SOMEONE'S CALLING, COMPLAINED TO THE MAYOR ABOUT IDLE. THEY HAVEN'T CALLED BECAUSE IT'S NOT AGAINST THE. PEOPLE CALL THE MAYOR, BUT A LOT OF THINGS. BUT NO ONE'S CALLING FOR IDLE. I DON'T THINK THAT THAT'S THE ORDINANCE. WE DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THE IDLING PEOPLE CALLING IN AND MAKING. NOBODY'S CALLING. RIGHT.

SO. SO WHY MAKE AN ORDINANCE? BECAUSE NOBODY'S CALLING DOESN'T MEAN IT'S NOT AN ISSUE.

YEAH. I DON'T ANYBODY COMPLAIN ABOUT TODAY. RIGHT NOW. TODAY IS NOT TODAY IS NOT A GOOD EXAMPLE. IT'S A BEAUTIFUL CLEAR DAY. BUT ESPECIALLY LIKE IN JANUARY WITH THE INVERSION, I BELIEVE IT IS AN ISSUE AND IT'S EVEN AN ISSUE NOW. I MEAN, A WEEK AGO I STOPPED BY ON MY WAY HOME AND IT WAS TWO WEEKS AGO FROM COUNCIL MEETING, BUT THAT WASN'T FROM I GOT DINNER FOR MY WIFE AT ZUPAS IN JORDAN LANDING. SHE HAD PLACED AN ORDER AND I STOPPED TO PICK IT UP AND FROM WHERE I PARKED MY CAR TO ZUPAS, THERE WERE THREE CARS IDLING ON A 70 DEGREE BEAUTIFUL SUNNY BEACH JUST LIKE THIS. THEY WERE RUNNING THEIR AIR CONDITIONERS. WELL, WHY? WELL, THEN YOUR

[00:45:03]

YEAH, YEAH. AND AGAIN, WARNING FIRST. PHILOSOPHICALLY, IT'S WORTH MAKING AN ORDINANCE FOR SOMETHING THAT COULD MAKE THE CITY BETTER. AND I DO THINK THAT IDLING DAMAGES ARE FAIR AND ISN'T NECESSARY. AND THAT ORDINANCE COULD HELP. JUST SEND THE MESSAGE, JUST LIKE WE WERE SAYING WITH WATER, LIKE YOU WERE SAYING THAT THIS IS IMPORTANT TO THE CITY. AND. I GUESS MY BIGGEST CONCERN IS. WE DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO HIRE ADDITIONAL POLICE OFFICERS BECAUSE OF THIS OR, OR PUT ADDITIONAL STRAIN ON POLICE FORCE. THAT IS BY FAR MY BIGGEST CONCERN WITH THIS ORDINANCE. THE MESSAGING I'M IN FAVOR OF, I DON'T THINK HAVING LIKE ORDINANCE. HOW MANY OFFICERS HAVE WE HIRED BECAUSE WE HAVE A DOG POOP ORDINANCE, ANIMAL SERVICE OFFICERS, NO POLICE OFFICERS RESTRICTIONS, NO FIREWORKS RESTRICTIONS ARE KEY. I THINK TWO THAT ARE VERY DIFFICULT TO EVER WRITE A TICKET FOR BECAUSE WE PUT THEM IN PLACE. SOME PEOPLE. AND THAT'S THE GOAL, RIGHT? WE DON'T PUT THEM IN PLACE BECAUSE WE'RE GOING TO CATCH ALL THE BAD GUYS AND WRITE THEM TICKETS. WE PUT IT IN PLACE BECAUSE THEN SOME PEOPLE IN THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS WON'T LET OFF THE FIREWORKS, SOME STILL DO, AND SOME PEOPLE WILL STILL AND SOME PEOPLE WON'T. GIVEN CHIEF ROBERTSON'S CONCERNS. AND PROBABLY NOT IN FAVOR OF MAKING IT A FINAL OR INFRACTION OFFENSE. PERSONALLY. I DON'T KNOW HOW ELSE TO AVOID MAKING IT AN ISSUE THAT THE POLICE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO DEAL WITH. I

[00:50:03]

WE'RE NOT. IT'LL LOOK LIKE THEY COPIED US. DO WE REQUIRE AN ORDINANCE OR ANYTHING? THAT'S JUST THAT'S. IS THAT GUY SENT YOU SOME STUFF ON TEAMS THAT I FOUND AS WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT THIS JUST ABOUT LIKE THE EDUCATION OF IT. IT EVEN SAYS HERE, EVEN WITHOUT ACTIVE ENFORCEMENT, WHICH WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, THE PRESENCE OF A RULE AND SIGNAGE, WHICH I KNOW THAT SOME OF YOU CAN'T CONTROL. BUT IF WE WERE TO TALK TO SCHOOLS, IT SAYS IT CUTS IDLING 5 TO 10%. AND THEY TEND DRIVERS TEND TO CHANGE BEHAVIOR WHEN THEY SEE POSTED LIMITS.

AND IF THERE WAS THESE SIGNS AT TRANSIT HUBS OR SCHOOLS, LIVING ZONES, IT REDUCES IT BY 2050.

SO I MEAN, EDUCATION IS IMPORTANT. HOW WE GET THERE, I DON'T KNOW, BUT IT'S IMPORTANT TO ME AS A YOUNG MAN. WELL, YOU COULD HAVE A STICKER IS WHAT MADE AN IMPACT ON YOU. RIGHT? SO WE COULD PUT MONEY INTO THE BUDGET AND HAVE SOME STICKERS THAT IT CAN HAVE THE WEST JORDAN LOGO. IT CAN HAVE THESE BE IDLE FREE, AND THEN WE CAN PUT IN MONEY FOR EDUCATION, AND THEN WE CAN EITHER DO IT OR THEY CAN HIRE SOMEONE TO DO IT, AND WE CAN DO SOME KIND OF A CAMPAIGN. AND I'M FINE WITH THAT. I JUST DON'T WANT TO SEE SOMETHING WHERE I CAN'T SAID, I JUST DON'T WANT IT TO BE SOMETHING THAT PLEASE, SIR, IT'S ONE MORE THING THAT SOMEONE CAN CALL ON THEIR NEIGHBOR FOR. AND IT'S ALSO ONE MORE THING. I'M TELLING PEOPLE WHAT THEY HAVE TO DO, I. AND THAT'S FAIR. I HAVE ENOUGH LAWS THAT NO ONE IN THIS ROOM, INCLUDING THE CHIEF, TELLS EVERY LAW. YEAH, BECAUSE EVERY YEAR THERE'S MORE. SO THERE'S NO WAY THAT WE CAN KNOW THEM ALL. YEAH, WE DO KNOW ABOUT THAT ONE. YEAH, EXACTLY. HOW ABOUT MEETING IN THE MIDDLE WITH A NON A NON ENFORCEABLE RESOLUTION WITH A CAMPAIGN OF THE FINAL THREE. SOME MONTH IN THE WINTERTIME. HOW ABOUT NINE THREE WINTER JANUARY AND MARCH.

YEAH. YEAH. AND THAT THAT OUT THERE. AND WE REALLY GO PAST OGDEN RIGHT. THREE TIMES BETTER.

AND I THINK IT'S GREAT. AND I THINK I THINK WE CAN ALL STEP UP AND DO YOU KNOW I THINK SOME OF OUR EDUCATION STUFF, WE CAN DO SOME FUN STUFF. WE CAN, YOU KNOW, SHOOT MEMBERS OF COUNCIL, WE CAN HAVE CHIEF DO LITTLE VIDEOS JUST TO REMIND PEOPLE THAT, YOU KNOW, I TALK, SOMEBODY'S GOING TO TAKE THAT CLIP THAT'LL GET THE WORD OUT. FIRST. COUNCIL MEMBER TO BE CAUGHT IDLING IN TWO MINUTES. YOU ONLY NEED TO DO IT ONCE, IS WHAT I'M SAYING. I WOULD BE HAPPY TO. EDUCATION WOULD HAPPEN THEN RESOLUTION. AND THAT'S WHAT IT SEEMS TO BE.

WHEN WOULD YOU WANT TO DO THE RESOLUTION? CLOSER TO WINTER. WHATEVER. IT DOESN'T MATTER IF WE DO IT NOW. THAT'S. THAT'S FAIR. WELL, CAMPAIGN WITH THAT. THERE IS BAD AIR QUALITY IN THE

[00:55:06]

TRAFFIC WAS INCREDIBLE DURING THE PANDEMIC THAT. PEOPLE DRIVE THEIR CARS. THERE'S A DIFFERENCE IN AIR QUALITY. WE SAW IT, WE HAD HIGH PRESSURE. WE HAD ALL THE THINGS THAT PROBABLY MAKE AN INVERSION. YOU HAD THE TEMPERATURE INVERSION, BUT YOU DIDN'T HAVE POLLUTION.

I DO LIKE YOUR COMMENT ABOUT BEING STRATEGIC WITH THE TIMING. SO, I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW THE RESOLUTION NEXT MONTH OR DO WE DO IT SEPTEMBER. I THINK WE DO IT ANYTIME AND I'LL WRITE IT UP.

TIME THE CAMPAIGN LEADERSHIP AND LET THEM DECIDE WHAT. I'M SAYING TIMING WISE. DO WE WANT TO DO IT CLOSER TO WHEN THERE'S ISSUES OR DO IT NOW? THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. YEAH, YEAH, YEAH. AND I'M SAYING THERE'S ISSUES. I THINK CLOSER TO WHEN THE IDLING ISSUES ARE THE WORST, WHICH IS IS THAT WINTER, I THINK I WOULD THINK IF WE WANT TO SAY A NO WINTER, THEN WE GET THE RESOLUTION UP NEAR THAT TIME. SO THAT THEN THERE'S THE, THE SYNERGY OF WE'RE DOING, YOU KNOW, WE'RE ANNOUNCING THIS. AND THEN THE KICKOFF ALSO GIVES MARIE AND HER TEAM TIME TO GET EVERYTHING READY AND SET. AND THEN WE CAN WE CAN HIT IT STRONG. AND IT SOUNDS LIKE WE'RE GOING TO BE DOING A LOT OF MESSAGING ABOUT WATER IN THE SUMMER. YEAH. SO THAT WAY WE'RE NOT THROWING TOO MANY. YEAH. YOU DON'T DON'T EVEN THINK ABOUT IT. DON'T LEAVE YOUR BLANK. YEAH. CAR KNOWS KNOWS. YEAH. OH YEAH. YEAH. THAT'S ESPECIALLY BAD. THAT'S KIND OF TILTED. OKAY. IS IT, DOES IT FEEL LIKE I MEAN, LIKE I SAID, WE'RE NOT WE'RE NOT TRYING TO IT'S AN OBVIOUS THING THAT PEOPLE SHOULD DO. WE SHOULD DO IT. RIGHT. I JUST DON'T WANT TO MAKE IT BE SOMETHING THAT CAUSES UNDUE STRESS. IT'S KIND OF LIKE TRYING TO ENCOURAGE IT, JUST NOT. YEAH. SO LIKE BACK IN THE DAYS WHEN WE WERE YOUNGER, WE HAD THE. LITTERING CAMPAIGNS GIVE A HOOT. DON'T POLLUTE, DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME. DON'T WASTE. IT WORKED. PEOPLE. DID.

PEOPLE GET FINED FOR LITTERING? SOME. IT'S ON THE BOOKS. CALLS ABOUT LITTERING. LARGE DUMPING SITES WHERE PEOPLE DUMP MATTRESSES AND STUFF LIKE THAT. BUT LIKE SOMEBODY THROWS A WRAPPER OUT, NOBODY'S GOING TO JUMP. YEAH, WE STILL HAVE. SHOULD WE GET RID OF THAT ORDINANCE? WE'RE NOT SAYING THAT. I KNOW YOU'RE TRYING TO MAKE YOUR POINT, BUT IT'S WE'RE TELLING YOU WHY ADD MORE OF THOSE ON THERE IF THEY'RE IF WE'RE JUST GETTING THERE, WE'RE NOT WE'RE NOT GOING TO WRITE IT. I DON'T KNOW IF THEY ALL HAVE AN EFFECT. I HAVE NOT SEEN ANYONE I SEE LITTERING ALL THE TIME, AND I DON'T THINK IT'S HAD ANY EFFECT. SO I CAN TELL YOU THAT MUCH. HOW DO YOU KNOW YOU DON'T SEE, I JUST ALWAYS SEE LITTERING, SO I DON'T KNOW THAT I DON'T SEE IT. PRETTY MUCH. I I'M OUT WALKING ALL THE TIME, EVERY DAY. SEE LITTER.

BUT YOU DON'T SEE THE LITTER THAT'S NOT THERE BECAUSE SOMEBODY'S NOT THERE. I DON'T SEE THE LITTER THAT'S NOT THERE. BECAUSE SOMEONE WENT, OH, WAIT, THERE'S AN ORDINANCE. SOMEONE MIGHT ALL PACK THIS AWAY FOR LATER. I DON'T SEE THAT. YOU'RE RIGHT. I DON'T, AND NO ONE EVER WILL BECAUSE IT DOES NOT HAPPEN THAT WAY. NO, BUT YOU ALSO CAN'T WHEN IT WHEN IT'S THESE KIND OF LAWS THAT ARE THE COMMON SENSE. I'M A GOOD PERSON, SO I DON'T DO BAD THINGS, LAWS.

YOU'RE NEVER GOING TO SEE THE EFFECT OF THAT. YOU'RE NEVER GOING TO SEE HOW MANY PEOPLE EVEN I HAVE NEVER KNOWN. AND I'M ON THE COUNCIL THAT WE HAVE A DOG FOOD LAW, AND I'M EXCITED TO GO LOOK IT UP. BUT YOU KNOW WHAT I DON'T DO? I DON'T I DON'T NOT PICK UP MY DOG AND I PICK UP ALL THE DOG POOP I CAN WHEN I'M DRIVING, WHEN THERE'S A LOT OF WALKS WHERE I'VE GOT 4 OR 5 BAGS BECAUSE I'M THINKING OF OTHER PEOPLE. WELL, THAT'S JUST THAT'S THE WAY I FEEL ABOUT DOG OWNERSHIP. SO I DO THAT. OFFICER. DOG PARK ANIMAL SHELTER, BECAUSE PEOPLE DON'T SEE A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T. I DO THAT WHEN I'M AT THE DOG PARK. I, I MIGHT BE ONE OF THE PEOPLE.

NO, I JUST BECAUSE I BRING A WHOLE ROLL OF DOG BAGS AND I JUST PICK IT UP WHEN THEY DO IT IN MY OFFICE OR MY FACEBOOK. ALL RIGHT. THAT'S GOOD. SO WE GOT A GOOD FEELING OF WHERE WE'RE GOING TO GO ON THAT. ZACH. YOU GOT TO WHERE YOU WANT TO GO AGAIN. WELL WE WE AGREE IN

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